This Week in Fisheries Management, on Facebook Nevertheless...

[Reel Class]

This is somewhat connected to Jerry's post below, but I really think this deserves a separate thread so the NJF community can see what's going on on the "outside."

I got involved in 2 discussions on facebook, as did some other posters on here, regarding regulations with striped bass. I'm not going to mention any names, or the names of the "groups" that the posts were within, but some of the things I read were incredibly disturbing. Most of these posts I read were extremely biased in the direction of MORE CONSERVATION in regulating stripers. As has been the case for decades, certain "groups" of anglers truly believe striped bass need to be regulated in a fashion where it's nearly impossible to keep any fish for subsistence, since, for them, they don't keep bass and basically release everything they catch.

Here are some of the things I read, in response to not only my replies or questions, but just generalized comments (again, I'm loosely quoting and even paraphrasing what I read and I'm not using any names, but what I'm writing gives you the "gist" of what these anglers are saying):

-"We should go vigilante and enforce regulations on our own."
-"We should pressure on both recreational and commercial fishermen by meeting them on docks and beaches and letting them know that it's unacceptable to keep killing bass."
-"Is it legal to make a citizen's arrest of a poacher?"
-"You're a for hire boat, and all for-hire boats, and 'chattahs' (stated by a guy from MA/RI that obviously has an issue with charter or for hire boats) and all for-hire guys could care less about the fish... All you care about is your livelihood and $$$."

And, some of the real outspoken guys made statements like:

-"Stripers are terribly mismanaged - the next moratorium is coming in 5 years!!"
-"Special interests in regulating striped bass need to be stopped!"
-Several said something along the lines of -- I'm dedicating my life to protecting striped bass!!

Some of their proposals:

1 fish @ 36"
1 fish @ 32"

And the like...

Some of the things I (and other like minded individuals) said, and objectively questioned - and stated MANY times in different ways:

-Where's the data that supports your claims?
-Who are you to question someone's livelihood?
-If a group of people was looking to take your livelihood away, what would you do? (directed at guys NOT in the industry)

I'm all for conservation, but these guys are out of line. Even worse, they have no data that support their claims - they simply are ingrained in learning that the stocks are falling apart, and they are making a real case (because they're given a voice!) for why these fish should be regulated further! The fact is, data supports the regs (which, within themselves suck!!!!) and data that supports a shutdown or some crazy, draconian closure does not.

As many pro's & guys that actually get it say, and I'm quoting my good friend Jerry P, "FISH HAVE FINS, THEY SWIM TO OTHER PLACES" -- the fish move... Their migration routes change, and we don't always get to actually see these fish. Some years you see loads of fish on the beach, other years you see the bass out in the mud hole, and they never come NEAR the 3 mile line. So when you get a couple of "runs" that suck, these guys come out of the woodwork and scream for a closure because, in their eyes, the stock is in trouble. (Kinda like the global warming crowd!)

There were MILES of bass ~10 miles off the beach in October, (scallopers and draggers saw them - and this is FIRST HAND INFO) and not one angler could get to them because of the EEZ and it's enforcement - those fish showed up in Cape May in December, only some of them (and they were caught by some of our friends in CM that are still in the water) and are now down off Delmarva. My guess is those fish would've been our fall fish, and were some of the bunker fish we caught in oct/nov in our area -- whatever the case, something kept them offshore (bait - namely sandeels that never made it inshore) and lo and behold, we had a crappy fall (surf guys caught squat) and the conservation crowd is bitching and moaning about there being no bass.

The intention of this post is to clearly state to our community, much of whom are subsistence fishermen, of what we're up against in regards to regulations and people screaming for fish, such as striped bass, to be further regulated.

I'll leave you with a thought from a NY captain, who stated it so well - again I'm paraphrasing but it's close enough for you to get the gist of it: "Striped bass are not a pagan god as viewed by some of the fishermen on our coast, they are a fish, and in turn, they should be managed as such..."

Feel free to comment

[1captainron]

These are the same liberal *******s who want to take your guns away and think the world revolves around them. They hate the cops until they get their ass kicked or mugged then cry for help....

I could address every point said, but what's the sense? This crap just goes on and on. Besides, what do you expect from FACEBOOK!!

[tautog]

Slot limit 22"-32" or 24"-34" to save the breeding stock and let guys take the small ones home. I caught at least 30 small stripers last year and never fished any further than the dock.

[Gerry Zagorski]

I'd like to see a slot fish under 28 and one 28 to 30 something but I don't think that is going to be approved since regs like that will be deemed to fall outside the 25% reduction in recreational landings that they are mandating nationally.

The reason I like the slot is for our fall fishery when the rats show up and they are the best eating. The reason I like the 28 to 30 something is becuase I don't like to see the big 40 plus breeders taken out of commission. Take a picture and release it. But that's just me.

Now one way we might be able to have our cake and occasionally eat it and be within the landings, might be to have a fish 28 to 30 something and have one trophy fish tag per angler to take one fish per year over what ever the 30 something mark is.

[AndyS]

The NC Division of Marine Fisheries (DMF) has issued a statement regarding the thousands of striped bass killed and thrown overboard during commercial trawling activity off the Outer Banks in the last few days.

Patricia Smith, the public information officer of the DMF, released the following statement in response to questions for the DMF and its director Dr. Louis Daniel:

“The NC Division of Marine Fisheries is investigating reports of numerous dead striped bass floating in the ocean waters in northern Dare County areas.

The estimates of the numbers of dead fish have ranged from in the hundreds to in the thousands

Oh how quickly we forgot what happened in 2011

[pgoins]

Well said Allen. I actually left another site because of some of theses so called conservationists. Many of them were actually just haters of charter boats. Some actually using some crazy math to figure out how many fish they take in NJ.

I heard things like. "Charter guys run at 5 days a week, two trips a day. Or 10 trips a week. They are able to keep a limit for their 6 fares plus captain and mate so thats 16 fish a trip x's 10 trips a week that's 160 fish a week. Then multiply that by the 1000's of charters in the state and you see why we need to have a moratorium." Statements like this are so wrong, but people read it and take it as fact.

Some of the other things I heard. These were regarding why the charters in the Raritan area were able to report great catches in 2014. Both spring and fall.
- Super Storm Sandy created Romer Shoal and now holds an irregular amount of fish. Thus charters are now fishing there and reporting great catches that normally would not.
- Also due to Sandy. Old Orchard light area now has 300% more structure(Yes this guy somehow figured out that there is 300% more structure) and of course now holds more fish. Letting captains post reports of great catches that normally would never have happened.

Fact is, there is always going to be people whining. I don't get why the surfcasters are blaming the charters so much. I'm in Northern Monmouth, and I blame it on the Army Corp of Engineers. They covered up every jetty all the way to Long branch. I really like the slot fish limits we had in the past. Would like to see a one at 24-28 and one 32"

[Capt. Jerry P]

Everyone who is worried about the "collaspe" of striper fishing should b more worried about seabass and fluke regulations ( two species that a dumbell could see are healthy) bc when get cut down to stricter unreasonable regulations on them it directly put more pressure on stripers in the spring n fall...esp in the for hire sector

[Reel Class]

Originally Posted by Capt. Jerry P

Everyone who is worried about the "collaspe" of striper fishing should b more worried about seabass and fluke regulations ( two species that a dumbell could see are healthy) bc when get cut down to stricter unreasonable regulations on them it directly put more pressure on stripers in the spring n fall...esp in the for hire sector

Jerry you're 100% right on this.

Only issue is these game changing species don't get the press bass get because bass are perceived by many to be an iconic game fish of god like proportions lol

Fluke seabass and tog need that attention and more guys (me included!) need to get involved because the super regulation of these fish are making our lives, as for hire guys difficult.

What happened to the SSFFF??

[Reel Class]

And... The guys "screaming" for more regs on these species are not cry baby elitists, but the regulators themselves!!!

[Capt. Jerry P]

Easy example...Take a boat that used to seabass fish in june ( recreational party and charter ) if the regulations become so bad for seabass or it doesn't open what will the party boat do? Now add good striper fishing to the equation...

The guy who used to private fish for seabass won't waste the money on fuel or bait ( can't blame him) to run to wrecks to only keep a few seabass or to throw back 100 18 in fluke. Prob will just stay local and live line bass.

Party boat can not get out to go seabassin bc of un reason able regs. But striper fishing is good... in turn u will see 40 bunker snags hanging from a party boat ( can u blame them). Upnorth boats stick with stripers that much longer bc keeper fluke are tougher to get.

Charter boats can't possible charge a charter for a full day of seabassin if it isn't open or the bag limit if so small u can catch a big limit ( sarcastic) in a 1hr...so trips will b combo and stop to liveline stripers.

All r truthful and will increase both the pressure and mortality of stripers no matter what the new regulations r for stripers. Yet u rarely hear anyone make mention of it.

It's all connected a lot more than people think. Same goes for boats up north. Close cod... more boats will go for stripers