Blackfish.. bad luck or bad numbers?

[MVP]

As I follow up to my original post. Private and open boat fishing is totally different animal than party boat fishing as I would not be able to put the consistent #'s I posted if all those trips were on a crowded boat. You do get those days if your put your time in that you dream about put they are farther and few between then when fishing on a six pack. The best time to go fishing is any date you can get out. You can try to cherry pick your days especially when driving long distance but you never know. When I travel more than 3 hours to fish I try to do back to back trips to stack the deck in my favor in putting a good catch together. What is considered a good catch really depends on who you talk to. People use the phrases all the time that I limited out. Just catching keepers does not make it a good day as you have to take the whole experience into consideration on a day on the water. You can have a 6 keeper day and limit out and many would consider that a slow day if putting in a full day of fishing others may think it was a banner or EPIC fishing. It is a matter of perspective
Some of the best blackfisherman that are out there you will never hear a peep out of them. They keep to themselves and rarely will share any knowledge or information with anybody. If you ask them how they did the standard answer seems to be we did OK no details whatsoever.
I have paid my dues and do not mind paying it forward to someone who is passionate about fishing and just wants to get better at it. If I can help in reducing the learning curve then why not help a fellow brother out.
If you are limited on funds and want to get out for a day I will Treat you to a day of fishing. No guarantee that we will have a banner day but I am almost positive that you will go home with some fish in the cooler. Send me a pm and we can see if we can work something out. I am sure we can learn a thing or two from each other that will make us better fisherman
Alex

[italianfisherman]

Originally Posted by dakota560

Bullet,

Lot of good replies to your post. Fishing pressure in the NY / NJ area is insane. We fished Tuesday and Wednesday this week, two guys Tuesday and five guys Wednesday and limited both days. As others have said, whites were the hot ticket although greens caught as well. We were fishing an area where Tuesday we were the only boat and Wednesday there were maybe throughout the morning maybe 6 or 7 boats. One other boat was catching, other boats not so much. All fish were quality 3 - 6 lb fish. Could see Sandy Hook reef from a distance and it looked like the Hudson Canyon at the height of the tuna season. Insane how many boats were anchored up both party, charter and private. Black fishing is one fishery as you know if you've been doing it for as long as you say where 5 feet can mean the difference between a mad dog bite and not getting a hit. I think the best advise you received is to consider an open boat or 6 pack charter if your fishing weekends. A railed party boat fishing a small piece with limited takers won't provide you your best odds at a good catch. Nothing against party boats or party boat captains as we have some of the best in this area but the nature of the fishery is an 80 - 100 foot boat won't be able to position everyone on board over a small piece of structure and a limited amount of fish is better divided among 6 anglers than 60. As far as your comment concerning cost, I'd rather have one successful trip than two disappointing ones. There are a lot of fish around but places are being hit hard. You need to move around and find a spot which wasn't hit hard recently. There are hundreds of spots to fish, don't only fish the ones which are popular and have 100 boats sitting on them during the weekend. Pics from our trip Wednesday....limited for 5 guys in about two hours BUT we fished maybe five drops Tuesday before finding the one which had good quantity and quality amounts of fish on it with little competition from other boats.

Agree, 6 packs for blackfishing is the only way to go.

[NJtuna]

Great offer MVP! Very nice of you. Another benefit of fishing on private or 6 packs is they can get on much smaller, less pounded spots. A party boat has to get on pieces large enough to try and have all customers over structure. These spots are pounded daily. A private boat can get on small pieces that may not have been fished often. They also should have small spots saved over the years that 90% of the boats don't have. I suggest taking up MVP on that generous offer first, then starting a monthly Tog'n fund to save up for the next season. Throw $20. a month in a can so when Nov. comes you can jump on two open boat charters and not worry about dishing out all that scrap in one month. Good Luck

[bulletbob]

Originally Posted by MVP

As I follow up to my original post. Private and open boat fishing is totally different animal than party boat fishing as I would not be able to put the consistent #'s I posted if all those trips were on a crowded boat. You do get those days if your put your time in that you dream about put they are farther and few between then when fishing on a six pack. The best time to go fishing is any date you can get out. You can try to cherry pick your days especially when driving long distance but you never know. When I travel more than 3 hours to fish I try to do back to back trips to stack the deck in my favor in putting a good catch together. What is considered a good catch really depends on who you talk to. People use the phrases all the time that I limited out. Just catching keepers does not make it a good day as you have to take the whole experience into consideration on a day on the water. You can have a 6 keeper day and limit out and many would consider that a slow day if putting in a full day of fishing others may think it was a banner or EPIC fishing. It is a matter of perspective
Some of the best blackfisherman that are out there you will never hear a peep out of them. They keep to themselves and rarely will share any knowledge or information with anybody. If you ask them how they did the standard answer seems to be we did OK no details whatsoever.
I have paid my dues and do not mind paying it forward to someone who is passionate about fishing and just wants to get better at it. If I can help in reducing the learning curve then why not help a fellow brother out.
If you are limited on funds and want to get out for a day I will Treat you to a day of fishing. No guarantee that we will have a banner day but I am almost positive that you will go home with some fish in the cooler. Send me a pm and we can see if we can work something out. I am sure we can learn a thing or two from each other that will make us better fisherman
Alex

x[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the offer MVP.. No need really, but its certainly appreciated.. Please remember, at the age of 61 I am an old time tog fisherman, and have always caught blackfish since I was a teenager without problems.. Won pools a few times as well, including my only time out for them last year.. Its not a matter of knowing how really. Usually if there are fish around I can hook up. Some will catch more and bigger NO doubt , but I typically hold my own.. Last year on my only trip for tog, I caught 3 and shared the pool with the high hook guy that had 4... I think that after that 7 fish there were only 3 other keepers on the entire boat.. Almost everyone on the boat caught none, and never had a single hit.. Thats when the thoughts for this post started coming together. After many trips like that in a row over the years, I started thinking maybe the tog were simply decimated.. Then this last trip the other day really got me thinking.. Is THIS the new normal for blackfish on a party boat??

Probably not.. I see the pictures here on NJF every day. Captains report shows limits of nice tog piled up in the stern on the bait cutting/filleting board.. pic after pic, not just one or two.. So I know that at least on some days, the tog or down there and willing to hit, even on a head boat.. I am beginning to think the time to come down is on a cold Monday in Dec when the boats sail with 10 guys or less.

This past summer I went on a 6 pack for sea bass and ling with a friend from up here.. We came home with 13 sea bass and 3 ling for an entire days fishing. Some got more, some less. Fish were super picky that day, no "Hot bite" anywhere.. Captain told us the previous day that it was all limits all around.. Point is, I see a pattern here.. I get down to NJ salt water when I can, MAYBE 3-4 times a year.. Best I can say is that for a while, many of my trips seem to be of the "shoulda been here yesterday" variety... We'll keep at it.. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while.... We'll hit the right day before long.. bob

[Tunarun]

That's a very very Generous gesture Alex, I applaud you. I'm one of those guys who are in the background and I think, I've never read a gesture like that. I think that elusive tog of 20 lbs will be rewarded to you, when, I can't predict that but it will Happen!! Dennis

Bob, we would have made a spot for you had I known you were in town. Bill Sasse and his brother-in-law fished with us today....It would have been a hoot if we timed it right and the three of us were in the same place at the same time. We've been blessed with luck in addition to skill and have been putting solid numbers in the box. I had a great day with green crabs today. It basically boils down to the old adage.....you want to catch more fish? Fish more often. I feel bad for you that you can't do that in your current situation, but who knows what the future might bring. Hang in there Bro, you'll always have a spot on my boat. Ed

[Detour66]

I went out on a SPB on Friday out of AH and the boat was packed ...all of the PB's where railed! Fished all day and got 2 legit bites and caught one blackfish. I would say 6 fish where caught on the boat all day. The SHR was wall to wall. Boats everywhere. There was a time when the SHR was considered "a run" and now everyone goes there. The place gets hammered! I think the conditions between the lack of wind and full moon screwed up the blackfishing but what do I know. There are always sharpies that get fish no matter what. Right now Stripers and Blackfish are the only shows in town, plus we are in a very congested area with to much fishing pressure. So hang in there. Pick your days and hopefully you will catch some fish.

[MVP]

Bob
As mentioned previously it is a numbers game. I have had 7 out of 8 trips that have been good this year with pool fish on all 8 of them. Yesterday I was on the Monger. We had no anchoring conditions at all. There is a reason Jerry is one of the best as he put us on a few fish short of a boat limit for 10 of us no thanks to me as I had 3 fish early and only managed 1 more keeper the rest of the day
Tried everything in my Arsenal but nothing seemed to work for me even though some guys around me put together very respectable catches throughout the day. As I mentioned earlier just when you think you are the man you get humbled by these toothy critters. Yesterday it was my turn to be the windshield. Just part of the addiction that keeps you coming back. You have received some very good advice that you should consider to help improve your catch. At 61 you are still a spring Chicken. I took my Dad out last week on a picky day and he still managed 4 keepers even though he does many things that most would say is incorrect.

[Gerry Zagorski]

That's what I love about blackfishing ...... A lot of times it's not the arrow but the Indian and things change every day. Very easy to go from hero to zero and sometimes in the same day.

Been out fishing several times and see a guy fishing a broom stick with an old beat up Penn Squidder with 30 pound mono put on a show while the guy with the $500 set up is shaking his head.

You ask 10 guys about what rod and reel to use and you'll get 10 different answers.

Legs off, legs on, shell on or shell off.

Hit em fast or let em chew.

Lots of variables to figure out every day and that's what keeps you coming back for more.

[bulletbob]

Originally Posted by Detour66

I went out on a SPB on Friday out of AH and the boat was packed ...all of the PB's where railed! Fished all day and got 2 legit bites and caught one blackfish. I would say 6 fish where caught on the boat all day. The SHR was wall to wall. Boats everywhere. There was a time when the SHR was considered "a run" and now everyone goes there. The place gets hammered! I think the conditions between the lack of wind and full moon screwed up the blackfishing but what do I know. There are always sharpies that get fish no matter what. Right now Stripers and Blackfish are the only shows in town, plus we are in a very congested area with to much fishing pressure. So hang in there. Pick your days and hopefully you will catch some fish.

Thanks for this.. It somehow encourages me.. I can see a lot of my bitch fest is really just about being on the right boat at the right time.. I too have had poor luck under the conditions you describe... I will always fish for tog because I enjoy it.. I just think I need to pick my trips more carefully.. The SHR gets absolutely hammered no doubt.. Thats why I stated I may just take the little longer drive down to belmar... Some good boats there.. I typically fish out of S boats from Belmar to PP, but AH is closer and saves me close to an hour each trip total.. Maybe 45-50 minutes some days, but it is still substantial.. Actually I had a better trip than you did LOL.. I got 3 legit hits on my trip and boated all 3 so I guess I was on fire!
Might try again this week,,, we'll see.. No more weekends and no more "holiday eves".. I will go when most other guys can't.. Thats worked better for me... bob