Sandy Hook Bay Shutdown to Fishing

[dfish28]

Arrrrrrrgh!!! My knives are sharpened and I'm pissed... Feel free to come aboard!
http://www.lucylearns.com/images/pir...alico-Jack.gif

[SaltLife1980]

[NoLimit]

I emailed Rik who is the contact person on the website and this might be a case of "Trust but Verify". He seems to be a dyed in the wool outdoorsman and has spent his whole life in the marine industry as an engineer.

Feel free to email him too. He got back right away and at first, it was pretty much what is on the website. "No, there wont be any new rules - yes we want to do research and public awareness - yes, we want to make fishing and clamming better". So it was all warm and fuzzy.

I then asked him what exactly did he have in terms of programs and this is what he came back with:
.....................................

The creation of an NMS will simply raise our awareness on things in the NMS, and provide a forum for adjustments, be they the recent closing of clamming in the Navesink, the difficult questions around the oceanic bridge replacement, the sudden removal of the oyster reef in the Navesink, bunker over fishing that affects the stripers, silting of the upstream waters that reduce striper breeding effectiveness, or the advantages of putting boats in lifts rather than painting boat bottoms with antifouling (although the latter is not a top concern in our rather well drained system)



I will readily admit that the NMS concept is complex and maybe even elusive at this stage, but we no longer have the luxury of making simple decisions in our crowded but very beautiful ecosystem. The days of settling, kicking out the Indians, cutting the trees and building a log cabin, and moving on once all the oysters are gone are over. We have what we have, and what we have is quite special, the trick is to manage it as one precious thing. The Sandy Hook NMS will let us look at the rivers and our portion of the bay as one thing, and hopefully this will provide clarity when difficult decisions have to be made. We are making difficult decisions today; the NMS will simply provide a clearer, more effective and more concise backdrop to make it against. We will be able to ask: How would the NMS feel about that?



Last night, during a presentation, we had a long discussion about the type of governance that this particular NMS should have and we are starting to get some ideas on that. The trick that everybody likes is to realize that those who live around the NMS probably know it better than others, and the governance system will weight towards that realization.



The most successful outcome will be an NMS where there is sustainable commerce, fishing and recreation (with the added benefit of more effective education and deeper cultural appreciation), and where, little by little, we can look back over a long time and say: You know what? Together, we made this thing better and more fun and we left it better for our kids to enjoy.



I own an 18 foot wooden Hankins diesel Sea Bright skiff (River Runner; wave to me when I go by your house in Highlands), a woodpussy sailboat, about five canoes and an iceboat. I also fish with friends on bigger boats, and provide engineering services to people around the river. I also like to bring in big boats on the river. If you search “Onrust” and “Navesink” you will see what I mean. I do not hunt and consider it a flaw in my upbringing, but I love it when I hear gunshots on cold winter days because it tells me all is well on the river. We are doing something that the first people who came here some 10,000 years ago were doing and we can still do it today. That is too cool for words. The NMS intent is that we continue to do that. But also that we do cast an eye on the NMS and say: Are we doing these things as well as we can? And if, over time, we can do better, let’s give it a shot.



Study the info that is on the website and in the pdf I sent. This thing is about “better for all”, within the reality that what we have is not unlimited. But if we are clever, we can all have more of it and have more fun doing it.



I will be presenting at the Red Bank Library on March 16. When I asked the library to present, the library director said: “But are you not mad at us? We put up a bulkhead and you suggested that we should have a soft shore line.” (this was about two years ago, and I did send a letter to the library when I heard about it)



I was never mad, I simply suggested that a soft shore line would be better for wild life and the library. At the time, I arrived at the discussion too late to make a difference, so a new hard bulkhead went up. If there had been an NMS, there is a chance that the town and library people would have been more aware of the benefits of a soft shore line and would have planned for one, and without me having to get involved. Regardless, I hope that if the library’s memory is sufficiently long (or if we have the educational benefit of an NMS), that in 50 or so years, when they need to replace the bulkhead again, they remember that soft shore lines are better and why.

.................................................. ......

So there it is and like I said, maybe this is a case of Trust but Verify. More knowledge is better than less and the fact that he is an engineer instead of some social science airhead might mean they want to deal with hard facts.

What does everyone think and will something like this help us - for instance can such an organization help us with the stupid laws that force us to take breeder fluke and let 17" males die of old age?

[scooter1010]

Originally Posted by dales529

Scooter I applaud your effort here to not only call attention to this but to follow up with it. As an RFA-NJ board member I reached out also and more to follow. To quote a board member I hold in high regard the goal of RFA is conservation and the goal of this could be preservation which are two distinct different goals. I will contact you soon with further information here and or via PM. The plus is Sandy Hook Bay is State regulated and it takes a Federal action to provide a NMS so there are options to take it on.

dales529
Thank you very much.

Conservation/Preservation are still terms that are used by NMFS, NOAA, AMFC, Historical Societies that have historically proven that they put undue hardships on fishermen. Which ever one this special interest group falls under I still personally fear that once a moniker of NMS gets established the door opens to any and all restrictive measures that can be implemented at anytime. Even if they call it a river preservation society a designation once implemented can lead to unforeseen abuse. Once something gets established it is an extremely tough battle to recall it. It's a battle that I prefer to fight before establishment rather than after.

[scooter1010]

No Limit

I am really curious why you would post a reply from Rik? I applaud that you actually reached out and emailed him but less then thrilled to see you do his work. When he replied to me and asked me to post it up to this website and others I refused. I refused and told him that he should join these forums and others and post up what he wants. The fact that he doesn't do it himself does give me some trepidation. There is a lot written on his website that I feel is very loosely worded and open for a wide interpretation. Do you seriously think that when they were presenting the Biscayne Bay NMS the people showed up in anti-fishing billboards? I am sure they showed up in Huk, Aftco, Columbia etc clothing and talked about all the benefits that everyone will have if this is passed. Talk is cheap but legislation becomes almost permanent. At the very least Rik could do is his own work. This is not a personal attack on you or anyone else. Everyone is entitled to feel and do what they want. This is not my website but I am glad I have a place to go and state that most titles, monikers, NMS, and legislation ends up not benefiting most in the end.

[NoLimit]

"I am really curious why you would post a reply from Rik?"

Because it disclosed specific actions they wanted to do instead of just the generalities that are on the website. That information is useful in determining where they might be going on this. I thought it indicated that they do want to provide for better fishing, clamming, etc.

If this group is something that will be positive for us, we should support it. If we see it is heading the wrong way, then we move against it. Maybe a local group will reverse the trend we have with state and feds. The more arrows in the quiver, the better your chances.

Keep your friends close and your (potential) enemies closer. I am going to check it out further and will get back with any updates. I am sure you will do likewise.

"I refused and told him that he should join these forums and others and post up what he wants."

That is one approach but I took another. More information and engagement is better than less at this point.

[reason162]

Originally Posted by NoLimit

More information and engagement is better than less at this point.

Appreciate the info, even if I have to wade through 4 pages of sheer hysteria to read it.

[njdiver]

Here are two sites that explain the process on how to create a NMS:

http://www.nominate.noaa.gov/

http://sanctuaries.noaa.gov/manageme...ignations.html

[Capt. Debbie]

You're not the tree hugger. That website lists his wooden boat building love at the site's bottom. Frankly I would rather use the boat, than fix the boat. But maybe I'm crazy?

Originally Posted by scooter1010

Captain Frank, one would hope they paid for meeting space but I'm guessing probably not. Either way it makes no difference. The fact that the above establishments allowed this group to use/rent their facilities should show that they are, at the very least, very uninformed of what happens when you sign up for the Trojan Horse. In my opinion establishments that are run by ill informed people are dangerous and should not be supported.

Where you come up with thinking I'm a tree hugger is beyond me. Maybe you can explain further? The only wood I admire swings between my legs.

[Tuna Tales]

Another attempt to close down fishing areas...just take a look @ Florida.

My suggestion is if you can - attend the meeting in Red Bank on the 16th. Also join the JCAA, NJOA and the RFA as these organizations are fighting BS like this from happening in the first place - politically.

This would really wipe out the rentals boats, smaller boats, kayak fishing and surf fishing in the Sandy Hook area.


Joe T.