Freshwater Fisheries Forum January 19:

[AndyS]

Like I said I did make prior arrangements for the clean up.

How many people attended ?? Groups like TU or RVTA there ??
Nice the bad weather held off and got the meeting in.

[thmyorke1]

Originally Posted by AndyS

Like I said I did make prior arrangements for the clean up.

How many people attended ?? Groups like TU or RVTA there ??
Nice the bad weather held off and got the meeting in.

I think a few clubs came in. Forget to mention some Round Valley anglers came in to voice some issues with illegal overlimits, happens around night time.

Was a good turnout of ppl but didnt count heads. Similar to last year's maybe a bit more.

thmyorke1 I was unfortunately one of the guys who heeded the Governor's state of emergency and missed today's meeting. Could you expand on what was discussed regarding LL salmon. Does NJ plan on maintaining the program and or expanding it? Was there any discussion about changes to size or possession limits? Would love to see the size limit changed to at minimum 15" in the three bodies of water currently at 12" or even "18 in all four impoundments in an effort to establish a true trophy fishery. Pennsylvania, Massachusetts, NY and Vermont all have 15" limits, curious why NJ opted for 12" in Wawayanda, Aeroflex and Tilcon but 15" at Merrill. Changing the possession limit to one would go a long way in establishing this fishery as well considering the effort NJ is making trying to develop it. Was there any discussion of whether F&G believes natural reproduction is occurring? All questions I wanted to ask at today's meeting, appreciate your comments.

[thmyorke1]

Originally Posted by dakota560

thmyorke1 I was unfortunately one of the guys who heeded the Governor's state of emergency and missed today's meeting. Could you expand on what was discussed regarding LL salmon. Does NJ plan on maintaining the program and or expanding it? Was there any discussion about changes to size or possession limits? Would love to see the size limit changed to at minimum 15" in the three bodies of water currently at 12" or even "18 in all four impoundments in an effort to establish a true trophy fishery. Changing the possession limit to one would go a long way in establishing this fishery as well.

Appreciate your reply.

(Mind this is in my own words and observations) One mentioned that salmon are clearly getting more pressure, but not only pressure but the majority are treating it like the put-and-take fishery that stocked trout are. He stressed that something should be done as this put-and-take practice along with the increase popularity of LLs wont be sustainable for long as LL salmon stocking, in numbers, is low.

Not sure what was suggested, assumes it means size + possession limit. Another gentleman suggested slots where you cant keep too many big fish.

Not too sure about F&G's response; but they stated they make sure the fish they stock are already at a good size, and they're aware they want to keep the fishery sustained. I would write them an email to get further reassurance, they will be making reg changes for 2021 I believe? They said they're going to a three year cycle instead of two now.

Thanks for your reply. Will email F&G as you suggested and plan on attending the Wharton meeting in February.

[Dave B.]

Originally Posted by thmyorke1

(Mind this is in my own words and observations) One mentioned that salmon are clearly getting more pressure, but not only pressure but the majority are treating it like the put-and-take fishery that stocked trout are. He stressed that something should be done as this put-and-take practice along with the increase popularity of LLs wont be sustainable for long as LL salmon stocking, in numbers, is low.

Not sure what was suggested, assumes it means size + possession limit. Another gentleman suggested slots where you cant keep too many big fish.

Not too sure about F&G's response; but they stated they make sure the fish they stock are already at a good size, and they're aware they want to keep the fishery sustained. I would write them an email to get further reassurance, they will be making reg changes for 2021 I believe? They said they're going to a three year cycle instead of two now.

Hi Dakota,
As thmyorke1, or 'The1' as I like to call him stated, there were a couple of gents who spoke up regarding the present state of the LL salmon fisheries, and essentially their goal was to more stringently regulate the size and/or bag limits as a means of developing a 'trophy fishery' for the LLS. They also asked about the possibility of expanding the program further.

The basic Div. response was that they (Freshwater Fisheries) are aware that some anglers would like to see measures established to help or allow a degree of trophy fishery to develop for the LL's. At this time there are no specific plans for any changes, however the biologists are developing and discussing various ideas to possibly achieve that goal. Bear in mind that the Div staff have to maintain a constant 'balancing act' between all the environmental variables, the numerous and varied user group desires and preferences, and in many cases societal perceptions as they try to work out the best methods to reach certain fisheries management objectives. Of those factors the environmental issues will almost always hold the greatest weight in their decision making.

They do plan to continue the LL stocking program, and if possible increase the numbers of fish they are able to acquire from Mass. F&W. They do not at this time envision including any more waterbodies in the program. As far as trying to establish this fishery, it will never be a 'self-sustaining' fishery. LLS are a stream spawning species and none of the waters they are stocked in have any suitable streams feeding into them. This will always remain a 'Put-&-Take' fishery in NJ, so any regulatory decisions will always factor in that reality.

As any reg change proposals are made there will be notice posted on the Div website and likely emails going out as well on the 'List-serve' service, and I'm sure that one way or another notice of any proposed changes will show up here on this forum. There will most likely be a public comment period, the comments on which they also often use as an impromptu poll to guage angler's sentiments towards proposed changes. We should expect to see something regarding this issue sometime between now and early 2020, with any changes going into effect in 2021.

In other conversations at the Forum, some guys spoke about possibly expanding the walleye stocking program to additional waters and possibly reducing or eliminating walleye stockings in waters that they (the anglers) felt had self-sustaining populations. Regarding the 1st item, of the few waters mentioned for possible inclusion in the walleye program the folks were given a brief education on the hazards of having too many top predator species in a given water body as far as both depleting the forage base below sustainable levels and competing with and possibly out-competing existing top species. One suggestion was to add Spruce Run Res to the walleye program. We already have hybrid stripers, northern pike, LMB and SMB in there as well as whatever trout roam in and out from the tribs. Adding another top predator such as walleye to the mix could greatly upset the balance that has developed amongst the present biomass.

As for the 2nd item, removing some waters from the walleye stocking list because the anglers believed they had established self-sustaining populations, the Div staff made it clear that was simply not the case. While the fish do go through the motions of spawning their actual success is essentially zero. This is due to a number of environmental factors, but basically walleye are stream spawners and none of the stocked ponds and lakes have adequate feeder streams to accommodate this. Further, whatever eggs are laid are usually quickly consumed primarily by yellow perch if they are in an accessible location to the perch.

There were a few of other presentations, the details of the Rhinehart Brook brook trout experiment were presented and discussed, the Columbia Lake dam removal project was covered, the topic of the golden shiner stocking program in Round Valley was discussed, and a very nice presentation on the health of many of our best LMB lakes was presented by Chris Smith.

Also on a side note, for those who've been interested in the Flatbrook telemetry study, that will not be repeated again this year. Enough data was gathered from the past two years to satisfy the information needs of the FFB to begin reviewing possible reg change proposals for the future. However, since we do now have the equipment the biologists are discussing what other waters and/or species they might consider for such fish movement studies. This however is something that is presently a fairly low priority since such studies are A; quite labor intensive, and B; the staff have a goodly number of more important projects and duties to accomplish in the immediate future.

Two items of note, both the Warmwater and Coldwater Comprehensive Fisheries Management Plans are due for full revisions, both of which are quite extensive documents requiring a tremendous volume of data compilation, preparation and writing/formatting. As a result some of the other activities the Freshwater Fisheries staff would normally do during the spring and summer will be cut back this year. Most prominently, lake and stream sampling outings will be greatly reduced for this year as the staff will be spending more time in the office and in the lab attending to their other job obligations.

[AndyS]

Wow, thanx for the feedback ! Remember you can always go to a Federated Sportsmen's meeting also. Here you can present your ideas- that is a direct pipeline to the F&W Council.

[NJSquatch]

Dave B thank you for the comprehensive write up.

[thmyorke1]

Originally Posted by NJSquatch

Dave B thank you for the comprehensive write up.

Forgot to mention that you were a star, being featured on one of the slides with a LL salmon from a recently new stocked body of water. F&G agrees that it is a LL.

Also the skillful angler program slide featured you (like 3 times lol), Chris, JD, and Mikey and others Im not familiar with I think.

Dave thanks so much for the comprehensive summary. Really appreciate as I'm sure the board does you taking the time to spell out the highlights of the meeting.

And to NJSquatch, congratulations on the mystery being solved and your first LL!