Fluke Stock Theory

[hammer4reel]

Originally Posted by Broad Bill

I agree with everything said and would love to have an in person meeting with people capable of carrying the bucket up the hill. I'll share my work with anyone at NEFSC or NMFS who will review it objectively and be more than happy to discuss my analysis based on their own data which was the intention from the beginning and share my calculations, historical trend analysis and conclusions. Anyone who looks at this objectively will realize the preferred use of increased size minimums to "manage" the recreational sector set in motion a chain effect of consequential damages to the biomass, gender composition of the stock, declines in the biomass and SSB and historically high discard mortality rates and historically low recruitments levels bringing us back to levels not seen since the 90's. After 30-40 years of management , we're killing the two things most important to the sustainability of any fishery, the breeding population and recruitment. No fishery survives without both and this one is certainly feeling the effects of decades long policy decisions negatively impacting both.

Watch this , just know in advance you will probably puke .

https://youtu.be/NRdxVQhcrYs?si=3TxABrGWb0jrlv-j




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[Broad Bill]

Dan while beyond appalling it's actually not surprising. North Carolina and Virginia are brutally corrupt states. It's what you and I have been saying for years. Any stock with a commercial presence in their own waters or any coastal stock they have a commercial interest in is at risk. They'll take the last fish until there's no more to take without giving it a second thought and everyone else pays for their corruption which isn't only fisheries management although they routinely turn a blind eye. It's corrupt elected officials on the take and a group of businesses who make a living bribing politicians to profit from a public resource. It's a completely broken system used by politicians who have the authority to make decisions and pull strings to become extremely wealthy. And after watching this video, no one should have any doubt, in the case of summer flounder, what happened to the Chesapeake stock which at one time was the most southerly part of the biomass. It was wiped out by NC and Virginia commercials and for years now they've taken their show on the road and will destroy every part of the remaining northern biomass.

Was especially interested in a few things. People who buy commercial licenses can retain countless summer flounder a day themselves for personal use while the recreational sector is shut down. Commercial licenses can be leased for profit to someone who knows nothing about commercial fishing. Third and maybe the most poignant is the statement that inshore trawling by commercial concerns causes discard mortality which exceeds the entire recreational quota AND goes unreported and not counted against the commercials annual quota. Can you imagine what happens during the winter offshore in the depths these schools are being harvested from. And we wonder why the fishery has fallen off the cliff. It only takes a minority of bad apples to rape the ocean, kill juvenile age groups and destroy a fishery. Selective harvest and regulations that give preferential treatment to the commercial sector will ultimately kill every stock. And in North Carolina it apparently is done completely in the open and not only allowed for but promoted by state politicians and enforcement agencies. Absolutely ^&$%#@! unreal!

Anyone interested in how the corrupt process we call fisheries management works should watch the video.

[Gerry Zagorski]

Originally Posted by hammer4reel

Watch this , just know in advance you will probably puke .

https://youtu.be/NRdxVQhcrYs?si=3TxABrGWb0jrlv-j




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Wow probably one of the most depressing, eye opening and informative fisheries mismanagement pieces I've ever seen.

Although it's mostly focused on NC, if you care about fishing and how it's managed and stacked against recreational fishing this is a must watch video!!

If nothing else just listen to the 17:30 to 18:30 section... What is a public resource is basically handed over to commercials for their personal gain.

[hammer4reel]

Originally Posted by Gerry Zagorski

Wow probably one of the most depressing, eye opening and informative fisheries mismanagement pieces I've ever seen.

Although it's mostly focused on NC, if you care about fishing and how it's managed and stacked against recreational fishing this is a must watch video!!

If nothing else just listen to the 17:30 to 18:30 section... What is a public resource is basically handed over to commercials for their personal gain.

I have been saying it for years . It’s not only a NC issue .
It’s those long range boats that are fishing everything from NC up through Massachusetts.
Those 7 day boats hit Massachusetts waters early when fish are moving in .
Their limits were lowered , but 2 years ago they would catch 80 thousand pounds of squid . And 30 thousand pounds of fluke per boat for a 5-6 week period .

Nj boars could fish outside 3 mile line right next to them .
Nj boats were catching 3000 a week , while NC boats were catching 30000.

.they destroyed their fisheries , and have moved onto everyone else’s .

The rest of the states need to grow a set of balls and push for federal changes to protect their states interest .

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[Gerry Zagorski]

Originally Posted by hammer4reel

I have been saying it for years . It’s not only a NC issue .
It’s those long range boats that are fishing everything from NC up through Massachusetts.
Those 7 day boats hit Massachusetts waters early when fish are moving in .
Their limits were lowered , but 2 years ago they would catch 80 thousand pounds of squid . And 30 thousand pounds of fluke per boat for a 5-6 week period .

Nj boars could fish outside 3 mile line right next to them .
Nj boats were catching 3000 a week , while NC boats were catching 30000.

.they destroyed their fisheries , and have moved onto everyone else’s .

The rest of the states need to grow a set of balls and push for federal changes to protect their states interest .

.

Yep!

[Broad Bill]

Originally Posted by hammer4reel

I have been saying it for years . It’s not only a NC issue .
It’s those long range boats that are fishing everything from NC up through Massachusetts.
Those 7 day boats hit Massachusetts waters early when fish are moving in .
Their limits were lowered , but 2 years ago they would catch 80 thousand pounds of squid . And 30 thousand pounds of fluke per boat for a 5-6 week period .

NJ boars could fish outside 3 mile line right next to them .
NJ boats were catching 3000 a week , while NC boats were catching 30000.

.they destroyed their fisheries , and have moved onto everyone else’s .

The rest of the states need to grow a set of balls and push for federal changes to protect their states interest .

.

Add insult to injury, the commercial allocations between states has been a bone of contention for years and to my knowledge is still based on commercial landings from the 1980's while the demographics of the stock has completely changed. Precisely why North Carolina and Virginia still have ~50% of the annual commercial quota which is a travesty. In 2019, New York sued NMFS, NOAA and the Secretary of Commerce for that exact reason for the unfair and outdated allocation of quotas between states. Link attached:

https://www.savingseafood.org/news/l...lounder-quota/

Ruling was made in 2023 against New York based on the grounds that regardless of where the stock is currently located, southern states who built their fisheries on this stock shouldn't be penalized by having their allocation percentages from 50 years ago reduced simply because the stock migrated north because of climate change. How's that for sound logic! Destroy their local fishery because of greed, keep their same allocation percentage of the quota based on landings from five decades ago and now destroy what's left of the last remaining northern stock. Political corruption within states, politics within the governing agencies, politics between states regarding quotas, politics between the commercial and recreational sectors and politics at the federal level and in the federal judicial system. How exactly does a fishery survive when the focus of all the agencies tasked with managing these public resources is on everything but managing the stock. It's all about politics, economics, power, control, corruption and greed. At the end of the day, when it comes down to fundamental fisheries management for the preservation and betterment of stocks, who exactly is keeping that scorecard?