Fluke Season is Open

[Billfish715]

These are smaller than some of the river fish I've caught. They were for sale in a local market. Notice the price on the sign which also indicates the place of origin or capture. Size limits or no size limits, these are fish that any of us would have voluntarily released. They were (at best) 13"! You can't tell me that at the price per pound, the commercial guys are not making a living! It's no wonder why the commercial fishing lobby is so determined to hold on to its share of the fluke quota!

The commercial fishery will get its share of the quota no matter how many fish they catch to get them there. Imagine how many fish of this 12" size they will take to make their quota. Unfortunately, if they threw those fish back, the fish would die anyhow.

The biggest obstacle for us (the recreational fishermen) to overcome is the fact that our quotas are nebulous. They can never be accurately measured and can only be determined by a conceived formula. Whether we meet a prescribed quota or not can't be accurately measured; whereas the commercial quota can be gauged by the required recorded weights at each of the commercial fishing co ops.

So the argument goes on. The recreational fishermen have no process to legitimately record the total weight of their catch and therefore there is no way to accurately determine how many fish they caught. As a result, the scientists can only estimate how many fluke were taken. The fear is that if the recreational fishermen catch too many fish there will be fewer for the commercial guys to harvest and therefore there is a threat they will make less money.

It's a vicious circle. One last observation is that the fluke that were for sale in the picture at best might have weighed one pound. In order to "monger" one pound of fillets, several fish would have to be cut up to fill the bill. How is any of this "conservation"? Establishing a larger size limit on commercial fluke would ensure more small fluke would be spared while still maintaining the same poundage quota with a smaller amount of fish being harvested. Wouldn't that be conservation? Isn't it better to harvest fewer fish which are larger and weigh more in order to promote the growth of more and bigger fluke? Or, if the fisheries managers are intent on conservation. then decrease the commercial quota of fluke. The reduction in quota tonnage would allow fewer fish to be harvested and in that way it would increase the fluke population.

It makes sense to me but what do I know? I'm not a scientist.

[Blackfish Doug]

I know what your looking at but those fish were probably 14" those trays they are laying over are either 8" or 10" wide. I know this makes you angry when you see the size of those fish because there was a time when you could keep fish this size legally & people did. I'm not against fish being kept at that size as long as they don't go over their limit poundage. If they throw back that fish after it's being caught all it's going to do is die. This is a copy of what they can keep legally nowhere in do I see a size limit. But think about it for second during Jan & Feb they are only allowed 2500 lbs a day or 5000 lbs a week. If your lucky enough to reach your poundage if the weather lets you & that's if your lucky add it up. 5000lb week limit at a average of about $ 2.00 to $3.00 a pound don't forget that commercial guy is not getting $12.99 a pound. That fish passed through at least 2 vendors before it reach's the market & everybody is getting a profit. So the person gets anywhere from $10,000 to 15,000 if they reach their limit remember it's hard to reach that number try it once & you will know what I mean. Now divide that number by 7 because that's your weekly limit. It's not much money when you add up your costs gas ,insurance,dockage, crews expense plus repairs. Did you ever look at the people who do this for a living? they are far from living great I don't see them driving Mercedes or Bentley's. Imagine having no sick days or holidays off working with broken arms busted fingers they do it it's not a great life. Our enemy is not the commercial guy it's the government who rules on our quota's. If both the fisherman & commercial guy can only get together on this more can be done. There are more recreational fisherman then commercial fisherman by a long shot. This is the website do the math add it up & think about more about the profit because it's not as great as you think.
http://njfishandwildlife.com/pdf/201..._quota2015.pdf

[nmc02]

I love fluck

[Gerry Zagorski]

The commercials are allowed to fish all year right? Not sure when Fluke spawn but maybe they should be closed to fishing during that time?

Also raising the commercials size limits could be a double edge sword.

Based on the science (which oh by the way is being party funded by the SSFFF) practically every Fluke over 18 inches is a female. I don't think we want their quota filled with female breeder fish. I'd much rather see them keep smaller fish.

Lastly, if you increase their size limit what happens to the smaller by catch fish? It makes no sense for them to be discarded, shouldn't they be kept and couunt towards their quota?

I'm certainly no expert here and would be interested to hear others opinions.

[hammer4reel]

commercial guys average 3.50 per pound.
they get 4.50 a pound for the fish that are over 5 pounds.

funny how we recs want to complain about having to kep all the larger fish which are females.
yet when the commercial guys quoata is most made up of male fish we still complain.

as Doug said , its more about us working together to create a stronger resource.


At the current trend the government is looking to get paid for every fish in the ocean, if its catch shares program ever gets through.
that will be the end of everything as we know it

[Capt Sal]

Originally Posted by Gerry Zagorski

The commercials are allowed to fish all year right? Not sure when Fluke spawn but maybe they should be closed to fishing during that time?

Also raising the commercials size limits could be a double edge sword.

Based on the science (which oh by the way is being party funded by the SSFFF) practically every Fluke over 18 inches is a female. I don't think we want their quota filled with female breeder fish. I'd much rather see them keep smaller fish.

Lastly, if you increase their size limit what happens to the smaller by catch fish? It makes no sense for them to be discarded, shouldn't they be kept and couunt towards their quota?

I certainly no expert here and would be interested to hear others opinions.

Fluke spawn off shore in the winter.Go to the Belford Co Op and you can see what they bring in. Hughe fluke that need to spawn.We can keep one weak fish but look in the co op and you will see monster breeders that came out of the pound nets.If they didn't keep the small fluke the by catch kill would be ridiculous. Although commercial fishermen are not our enemy ,they could care less about the recreational fishermen. Teaming up with the commercials and bringing this to the high courts will never work. Hammer is on the money saying ''catch shares'' will be the end of recreational fishing as we know it. I would hope all the discussions about this will help to educate some of the newer people getting into our sport.

[NoLimit]

Keep whistling past the graveyard. I am sick and tire hearing that its not the commercial fishing fault. There are no more flounder, the weaks are gone, whiting are gone, ling and fluke are disappearing too while everyone sits on their hands. Yes, stripers are much better than they used to be and thats what makes it so hard to understand why we cant do anything about fishing during the other 10 months of the year.

One or two more seasons of this and I am out of here along with the money I spend on slips, fuel, bait, tackle, meals and housing.

[tautog]

No more flounder?...*LFAO* Plenty of flounder, just not people fishing for them due to the regs.

[Billfish715]

This quota and size limit system is supposed to be about conservation, I think. Recreational fishermen are able to practice catch and release while commercial netters are not. After being dragged around in the cod portion of an otter trawl, very few fish are going to survive and be returned to the sea. Even though the mesh sizes were increased to help smaller fish escape through the net, once the cod end starts filling with fish, even the small fish don't make it out. The other side of the argument is that many of the recreationally caught fluke don't survive either due to improper handling or hook removal.

We all have opinions about the condition of the fluke fishery and of its future. I've been fishing for fluke for over sixty years and there has never been a time when there were no fluke to be caught. That includes the many years when there were no regulations. I agree that there should be some form of monitoring of the fishery and that there should be education about the importance of conservation. Fishing alone will not destroy the fluke population. My opinion is that it would take something cataclysmic to destroy the fluke fishery like disease or destruction of breeding grounds, habitat, or forage. But again, that's just my opinion.

Recreational and Commercial fishermen have the same interest. No one wants to see the fluke stock disappear and jealousy among fishing groups is not an answer to our problem. An equal share in the harvest should be our goal. Unity within the ranks of both the commercial and recreational groups will go a long way to reach that goal. There are plenty of fluke to go around.

My suggestions about the commercial industry were based on some observations. By dropping their quotas, fewer fish would be harvested and therefore the price of the fish would be increased by supply and demand. The fewer fish for sale means that both the wholesale and retail prices increase. By flooding the market with more fish, the prices will decrease. The economic value of the fish will dictate how the conservation of the fishery will or will not work.

It's a controversial issue for sure, but it is not all doom and gloom as some will have us think. Being controlled and seemingly ignored by the government agencies has been everyone's complaint. It's time for everyone to get on the same page and put our fears and goals on the table and come to a consensus.

[bulletbob]

Originally Posted by Blackfish Doug

I know what your looking at but those fish were probably 14" those trays they are laying over are either 8" or 10" wide. I know this makes you angry when you see the size of those fish because there was a time when you could keep fish this size legally & people did. I'm not against fish being kept at that size as long as they don't go over their limit poundage. If they throw back that fish after it's being caught all it's going to do is die. This is a copy of what they can keep legally nowhere in do I see a size limit. But think about it for second during Jan & Feb they are only allowed 2500 lbs a day or 5000 lbs a week. If your lucky enough to reach your poundage if the weather lets you & that's if your lucky add it up. 5000lb week limit at a average of about $ 2.00 to $3.00 a pound don't forget that commercial guy is not getting $12.99 a pound. That fish passed through at least 2 vendors before it reach's the market & everybody is getting a profit. So the person gets anywhere from $10,000 to 15,000 if they reach their limit remember it's hard to reach that number try it once & you will know what I mean. Now divide that number by 7 because that's your weekly limit. It's not much money when you add up your costs gas ,insurance,dockage, crews expense plus repairs. Did you ever look at the people who do this for a living? they are far from living great I don't see them driving Mercedes or Bentley's. Imagine having no sick days or holidays off working with broken arms busted fingers they do it it's not a great life. Our enemy is not the commercial guy it's the government who rules on our quota's. If both the fisherman & commercial guy can only get together on this more can be done. There are more recreational fisherman then commercial fisherman by a long shot. This is the website do the math add it up & think about more about the profit because it's not as great as you think.
http://njfishandwildlife.com/pdf/201..._quota2015.pdf

With all due respect.. If there's no or little money, than get out,, Very simple.. Hell, I drove a damn school bus and most of the drivers I work with are over 30 k a year, and a few are in the 50-60 K range.. If these poor souls that fish commercially are driving rusted out junk, living in shacks, and have no health insurance, get the hell out, and do something else.. We'll put them to work up here starting at $15 an hour, top benefits, pension, and TONS of time off.. Must be similar work in NJ, another big union state... Personally I don't buy the "poverty wages" shtick... If things are that bad and these guys are not eating well, can't afford a doctor, can't pay for gas and slip, they need to GET OUT and leave the fish in the ocean... Sorry, money, BIG money is being made, or there would be no commercial fishing glut as we have today.... bob