[njbassman]

he's probably talking just a lip gaff to lift them out of the hole... no permanent damage to the fish, just like a big fish hook[/QUOTE]

thanks gents... was eager to get this one on the scale... had two decent ones come unbuttoned at the hole last winter... this time around gaffe was in hand... and yes for a lip job... she wan't that big it turned out and the head came up nicely....