Re: Flounder
 

First couple of blues caught in Cliffwood was always the end of the spring run of flounder. Can't say I blame them. One observation at the time of their demise was, nearly all of the Party boats from AT fished the rivers, Port Monmouth flats , the Cedars etc in the spring.. Then all of a sudden the marquis read " Jumbo Bay Flounder" and they were all over the west end collectively pulling hundereds of egg laden females a day. It was only 2 years later that the decline hastened.
My personal hotspot was destroyed when the Keyport harbor channel was dredged. The South flats were barren from then on.

Re: Flounder
 

I grew up fishing Sandy Hook, Shark River and the Manasquan River for winter flounder. Every year in the '70s early to mid '80s those bodies of water were absolutely paved with flounder ranging in sizes from small to jumbos. You could follow the schools as they came out of the mud to drop their eggs and start they're migration from the bays to the inlets or ocean and begin their offshore migration east. In the Atlantic Highlands, the start of the season was marked by the party boats fishing around the Quay, back bays areas and flats. Then you'd follow the schools as they started schooling up and moving out. Channels, areas around Earle, then it moved closer to the mussel beds at Flynn's Knoll and Roamers Shoals and as Skolman mentioned they poured into the ocean staging at the Cedars for a few weeks to feed up before their long journey offshore. You could catch all the jumbo flounder and big ling you wanted at the Cedars for a few weeks before the blue fish and stripers showed and the flounder immediately headed for Dodge. That was the ritual every year, year in year out, and it wouldn't be unusual to catch 40 or 50 flounder in a day's time from shore without using chum. Like the ling and whiting fishery, fast forward to the late 80's when the commercial fishery started targeting winter flounder after the summer flounder fishery crashed. All you need to do is look at catch levels in the 80's and 90's, larger species were targeted offshore, spawning stock was destroyed, recruitment went from 60 million new fish introduced into the stock every year to less than 5 million today and a biomass crashed. That fishery has been irreparably damaged and it's not coming back. We're staring down the barrel of a gun right now with the same thing happening to the summer flounder fishery and for those of you that don't think that's possible believe me nobody thought the winter flounder fishery could be destroyed in the 60's, 70's and early to mid 80's but it was. No one believed even more so the ling and whiting fishery that we had which was absolutely off the charts incredible could be destroyed and it was as well. Both of these fisheries were destroyed within a relatively short period of time. With the technology in place back then and even more so today, it only takes a few years to wipe out a stock and decades for it to recover, if it's even at all possible.

Re: Flounder
 

Shark river was a great flounder nursery .
With over 95% of it filled in with road dust from the storm water systems of all the local malls it can’t recover .
Only way would be if they dredged the entire estuary , and that’s not happening , they barely care about keeping the channels open .

.
Cause and effect plain and simple

Re: Flounder
 

This was what 1980's? You'd have to catch them on an industrial scale daily to do that.

The whiting disappeared up here too and so did the weakfish.

Migration patterns change. Whoever heard of large Drum in RB? Or the yearly visit and spotting of a huge Sturgeon that no one fishes for. But there's not 1000's of Sturgeon either.

Nature has a cycle.

Even crabbing up north in Shrewsbury and Navesink Rivers stunk the last two seasons with smaller crabs all season long.

We can blame the Evil Commercial Empire as they are convenient scape goats on a Rec fisherman site. But that is very suspect too.

Re: Flounder
 

I'll agree with that when it comes to flounder.. However it was commercials that destroyed the Whiting/Mackerel/Weakfish, no doubt in my mind.. I still recall the pound nets in Raritan Bay killing untold numbers of spawning Weakfish every year, until they were pretty much gone...

Flounder had more issues than just commercial pressure, and yes, we recs took WAY too many back in the 80's... I too recall when the party boats abandoned the rivers back in the day, and I was right in the middle of them in shallow water in Union Beach where I lived at the time, not 1/4 off the beach in my 12 foot rowboat, everyone catching massive blackbacks, until they were gone too.. Once the rivers were not producing flounder it should have set off alarm bells.. It didn't.. They just went to where there were still fish to be caught... until there weren't... No it wasn't all commercial guys, we recs did plenty of damage too.. However, they are at least as complicit as we are for the bad situation we are in with flounder, and are certainly the main cause of the disappearance of other species... bob

Re: Flounder
 

The Belford Pirates were dragging nets all over the bay. When they got caught they got a slap on the wrist. That is exterminating a flounder species . To blame it on hook and line fishing from PB boats is not true. Years ago when i chartered i got one month of flounder in before bass fishing. It paid for the slip and insurance. All the for hire boats got hurt by this and the decimation of our Whiting fishery. You can thank the Belford Pirates for that also.

Re: Flounder
 

What Captain Sal said - there is no way that recreational fishing ever decimated any fishery

Re: Flounder
 

That’s not totally correct .
Recreational fisherman really abused the winter flounder fishery .
Tons of boats catching garbage cans full after filling a cooler in the hay day .
We all thought it was an endless flow of fish .

Second one is striped bass , killing millions of breeders when they are stacked up laden with roe , and easy pickings .
.

NO fish should be targeted during their spawn .
Sadly that’s when winter flounder and striped bass get fished the hardest

Re: Flounder
 

Hey Dan to i have to FACT CHECK YOU LOl First of all Whiting spawn like every other fish. Winter Flounder spawn in the spring? So we we shouldn't fish for them in the Spring. Blues spawn in the Summer??? Shut that down also. Stripers spawn in the Spring so shut that down also. When do Tuna, Tilefish ,Makos ,Theshers etc. spawn? Sea Bass go off shore and spawn in the winter along with porgies??? No more off shore PB fishing. We all want to protect the stocks and protect the future of all species but at what cost? If we do what you want there would be no need for your charter boat or any for hire boat and who would buy a private boat??? Comments welcome but let all o0f us keep them civil! We are all entitled to our opinion and this one is just mine. Other than that it is 82degrees and sunny here in Florida LOL

Re: Flounder
 

I know I am in the minority here but the concept of killing a spawning female really is just a feel good idea. Whether you kill it in Jan or July a dead fish cannot reproduce. The only fishery that has responded to regulations in my opinion is the Striped Bass and they were banned from commercial harvest. Granted I am not a scientist but it seems obvious what needs to be done if indeed we want to see a rebound in stocks of any species.