Reducing Recreational Mortality

[shresearchdude]

I'm a bit skeptical about this one... remember I'm just passing this on...
The local?(to Raritan Bay?) Commercial Hook/Line fisherman and a professor from FDU presented the following at the Mid Atlantic Fisheries Council Meeting yesterday.

What they were trying to propose to the council is that by having Recreational fisherman only use Larger hooks then the mortality figures shrink and then everyone can keep more fish. There were comments from the Council, including Johh McMurray that is/was? a charter guy about how Recreational fisherman are there for the experience not just to harvest fish.

http://static1.squarespace.com/static/511cdc7fe4b00307a2628ac6/t/551edd7de4b0b038c6c1799a/1428086141609/Tab+09_Summer+Flounder+Bycatch.pdf


and yes there were many variables not measured or addressed. They claim that they will do a similar study with "wide gap" and "circle" hooks if they get funding.
This could also backfire for them considering the statistics that they provided.

remember this is just part of my personal point of view....

[Capt Sal]

Use the biggest hook you can use that will still catch fish. Small hooks on fluke are killers. Dead releases. We go as big as 12-0 for stripers!Leave the fresh water stuff home!

[bunker dunker]

I guess it must be true after all,the recreational fisher people are the blame for
everything.

[1captainron]

Can't wait to see the Buck-tailers with 8'0 Spro's !!:D

[JBird]

I know this is like an annual thing but it usually waits for fluke season but it's relevant here. The "English bend" or "Kahle" hooks should be outlawed. I've been converting anglers for 12 years to regular J hooks or, my favorite, the octopus hook yet some still think you need those silly hooks to catch fluke and it is 100% false. After unhooking bazillions of fluke over the years I can tellyou that those ridiculous little gold hooks are the worst. Get rid of them and you will save some fish from the crabs.

////Cue the outraged flukers.../////

[reason162]

On the subject of gut hooking fluke: I've always thought that party boat rental rods should go with a dropper loop rig instead of a fishfinder/3-way type deal.

Sinker on the bottom, hook off a short dropper loop...use bait, use gulp, use bait + gulp ---- fluke hook themselves after they turn to the bottom, and you tend to feel those fish immediately even with rental rods/40lb mono, as opposed to a hook on a 3 ft leader trailing behind a heavy sinker. No more "feeding" the fish, counting to 30, leaving a trail of dead shorts behind bc the summer crowd can't feel a 12 inch fluke chewing on their squid strip.

Also, at least once the water warms up...I think it would catch a lot more fish as well, esp on a slower drift/wind against etc. Your bait will have a lot more action than on a fishfinder rig.

Just my 2 cents.

[1captainron]

On the subject of gut hooking fluke: I've always thought that party boat rental rods should go with a dropper loop rig instead of a fishfinder/3-way type deal.

Sinker on the bottom, hook off a short dropper loop...use bait, use gulp, use bait + gulp ---- fluke hook themselves after they turn to the bottom, and you tend to feel those fish immediately even with rental rods/40lb mono, as opposed to a hook on a 3 ft leader trailing behind a heavy sinker. No more "feeding" the fish, counting to 30, leaving a trail of dead shorts behind bc the summer crowd can't feel a 12 inch fluke chewing on their squid strip.

Also, at least once the water warms up...I think it would catch a lot more fish as well, esp on a slower drift/wind against etc. Your bait will have a lot more action than on a fishfinder rig.

Just my 2 cents.

3 ft.leader, 40 lb test? Sorry my friend but I don't know what Party boats you are talking about, certainly not mine....customers are not schooled to count to 30 then set the hook. No English hook's here and larger J hooks to prevent damage...take this somewhere else.:mad:

[tautog]

14/0 xxx strenght circle hooks for porgies.....:D

[Joey Dah Fish]

All good points. I have a question/statement regarding those gold English style hooks. I have found them to be helpful due to the fact that if you gut hook a fish you just cut the line the hook dissolves extremely quickly. I left a couple in a bag on the bost came back the next day already rusting away. Your thoughts? I would like to know if I'm on the wrong track. I'm not a big fan of murdering fish

[bigfish1011]

BYOB... Bring you own bait- i.e.: squid strips

[hammer4reel]

Can't wait to see the Buck-tailers with 8'0 Spro's !!:D

START , been using 7/0 on bucktails to 6 OZ
everything over 6 OZ has an 8/0 in it

AND even 14" fish have no problem getting those hooks in thier mouth

http://i773.photobucket.com/albums/yy12/reelmusic/fishing%202015/20150416_180524_zpsmuxuhfxj.jpeg (http://s773.photobucket.com/user/reelmusic/media/fishing%202015/20150416_180524_zpsmuxuhfxj.jpeg.html)

[Joey Dah Fish]

As Shrimpman would say " I use a #9 and if you think that's to big you're wrong"

[reason162]

3 ft.leader, 40 lb test? Sorry my friend but I don't know what Party boats you are talking about, certainly not mine....customers are not schooled to count to 30 then set the hook. No English hook's here and larger J hooks to prevent damage...take this somewhere else.:mad:

Wasn't talking to you and never fished on your boat; calm your horses.

[fishguy]

Wasn't talking to you and never fished on your boat; calm your horses.

Not for nothing who were you talking too? When you post stuff you pretty much are saying what you say to the whole internet universe. That's how it works. Capt. Ron made a valid point about how he runs his business, the business of running a party boat, which is what you were making generalizations about. Honestly, a "30 count" before you set the hook? Never heard of that. Have you tried the rig you suggest party boats use? Any success?

[NoLimit]

The next thing, they will be telling us to use no hooks.

Recreational fishing does nothing to fish stocks. Lot of fish go by without biting and those that do are a drop in the bucket.

Its like the Parkway rest stop - most cars just drive by without feeding.

Commercial fishing is like putting a net across the Parkway and then a couple schoolyards for good measure.

[reason162]

Not for nothing who were you talking too? When you post stuff you pretty much are saying what you say to the whole internet universe. That's how it works. Capt. Ron made a valid point about how he runs his business, the business of running a party boat, which is what you were making generalizations about. Honestly, a "30 count" before you set the hook? Never heard of that. Have you tried the rig you suggest party boats use? Any success?

It's basically a hi-lo rig w/o the bucktail at the bottom. It works well.

You've never heard of the 30 count? It's an approximation. I've witnessed a 10 count, a 30 count, a 50 count, and of course: the count that starts after a good 30 second chew from a 10 inch fish...hard to detect through a fiberglass baseball bat and an 8 oz sinker in a ripping drift.

I've never fished on Ron's boat. Maybe short fluke never swallow hooks on his rental rods, I wouldn't know. I do see a ton of swallowed hooks on the party boat trips I've been on.

[fishguy]

It's basically a hi-lo rig w/o the bucktail at the bottom. It works well.

You've never heard of the 30 count? It's an approximation. I've witnessed a 10 count, a 30 count, a 50 count, and of course: the count that starts after a good 30 second chew from a 10 inch fish...hard to detect through a fiberglass baseball bat and an 8 oz sinker in a ripping drift.

I've never fished on Ron's boat. Maybe short fluke never swallow hooks on his rental rods, I wouldn't know. I do see a ton of swallowed hooks on the party boat trips I've been on.
Sooooo, you are suggesting that party boats use a 2 hook bucktail rig on the rental rods?

A 50 count? That's special.

[Charlie B]

Lower the size limit so you could keep the gut hooked fish and it becomes part of your bag limit. When you reach your bag limit stop fishing. Problem solved...Charlie

[Capt Sal]

It's basically a hi-lo rig w/o the bucktail at the bottom. It works well.

You've never heard of the 30 count? It's an approximation. I've witnessed a 10 count, a 30 count, a 50 count, and of course: the count that starts after a good 30 second chew from a 10 inch fish...hard to detect through a fiberglass baseball bat and an 8 oz sinker in a ripping drift.

I've never fished on Ron's boat. Maybe short fluke never swallow hooks on his rental rods, I wouldn't know. I do see a ton of swallowed hooks on the party boat trips I've been on.

Ridiculous ! Everyone knows you have to count to 34 or it does not work lol Your post is "convoluted" like all the other ones.

[bunker dunker]

this is the time when we start to argue between ourselves and not look at the the real problem .i have no problem with any one making a living until they
don't want to share.sounds like they want everything for themselves and the only way to do that is to get rid of the rec peeps. it will always be a struggle.

[phil]

the best way to reduce rec mortality is to lower the min size and let people KEEP SOME FISH then go home. instead of picking through 50 shorts to get 2 keepers. Raritan bay is paved with fish that are 2" to short, get thrown back and turn into crab food.

[Capt. Debbie]

Bigger gaps and longer J hook shanks. I have tried both to prevent gut hooking. It still happens.

But wider gap does seem to reduce, but not eliminate deeply swallowed hooks.

[reason162]

Sooooo, you are suggesting that party boats use a 2 hook bucktail rig on the rental rods?

You don't seem to read very well.

[shresearchdude]

Bunker Dunker nailed it.

"If they "recreational" don't contribute so much to the mortality then we "commercial" get to harvest more". I put that in quotes so I'm not accused of thinking that way.

Hook/line is a "cleaner" way to harvest fish that produces a product in better shape and doesn't destroy bottom habitat(or every other fish that gets into the nets).

But it seems that fighting for the resource will always go on...

[fishguy]

You don't seem to read very well.

I cain't read like I used ta could.