Thanks to those who fight and post here

[dales529]

I dont know about the rest of you but after a few weeks of reading numerous posts, reading and re-reading the stock assesments just listed and listening to the audio from the congressional hearing on the re-authorization of magnuson stevens 2006 my brain is swimming (in a good way). I have to give CREDIT to those that have obviously spent countless hours reviewing the information to the point they can post information / opinions. I for one have to read and listen again and again as I want to jump off my chair and scream at so many points and then come back to earth and then want to scream etc etc.

Given the obvious lack of attention paid to this forum, ( just look at the views, posts and replies compared to, well duh!) I was skeptical (and I pushed for it with Gerry) but now realize what an informative tool it can be and if it does NOT get a RISE out of the everyday fisherman at least it gives a place to be heard from those that have put the time and research in to inform us and TRY to get us off our asses.

You all know WHO THEY are and what groups they associate themselves with, just hope one day we give a damn like they do as I am just scratching the surface on what they knew was a FIGHT a LONG TIME AGO

JMHO

[hammer4reel]

I dont know about the rest of you but after a few weeks of reading numerous posts, reading and re-reading the stock assesments just listed and listening to the audio from the congressional hearing on the re-authorization of magnuson stevens 2006 my brain is swimming (in a good way). I have to give CREDIT to those that have obviously spent countless hours reviewing the information to the point they can post information / opinions. I for one have to read and listen again and again as I want to jump off my chair and scream at so many points and then come back to earth and then want to scream etc etc.

Given the obvious lack of attention paid to this forum, ( just look at the views, posts and replies compared to, well duh!) I was skeptical (and I pushed for it with Gerry) but now realize what an informative tool it can be and if it does NOT get a RISE out of the everyday fisherman at least it gives a place to be heard from those that have put the time and research in to inform us and TRY to get us off our asses.

You all know WHO THEY are and what groups they associate themselves with, just hope one day we give a damn like they do as I am just scratching the surface on what they knew was a FIGHT a LONG TIME AGO

JMHO


I have to agree Dave, a member tries to help the cause and set up a fishing trip to help the RFA and gets 18 people interested, yet put up a challange and it gets over 3000 hits.
Shame all the guys cant do something to help themselves and just back the guys who arent LAZY and are fighting for each and every fisherman here.

Pretty sad most fisherman are taking a beating by the goverment regs and dont have the balls to help themselves !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Instead they just sit by and watch what they love doing get taken away and then want to bitch after the fact

Worse is they prob throw more money away with unused bait than is needed to help the cause, and keep fighting for us to be able to fish for something

[Capt. Lou]

Not surprising to me, most so called fisherman are not even aware of many of our regs. We cannot expect them to contribute one dime. Look at the previous post many hits, few takers. This is the way it will always be,a small group will address and hopefully maintain our fishing rights, while most will just talk or not even take the time to become aware of fisheries issues. I recently sold my boat and have taken a few trips on charter ,party boats, while I'm in between rigs,the average guy on these boats doesn't even know the limit on the fish he's going after!!
If we cannot educate the vast majority then we're in for a long battle.

[Reelron]

"most so called fisherman are not even aware of many of our regs."

"Pretty sad most fisherman are taking a beating by the goverment regs and dont have the balls to help themselves !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"


Please stop generalizing and putting people down. Don't we get slammed enough by the tree huggers? There is no need to berate those that aren't as vocal about their support. Educate those that don't know and they may join in the battle, put them down and they will walk away.

I feel this is a different type of forum and you will never see the amount of traffic here that you see in other areas. Here I read the post, learn, comment if I want to, take action, by supporting what organizations I can by the means I can. In the other areas I may view a post many time more just to see what snappy comeback someone else has posted. So there are going to be more views on that type of post.

As for trips to support an organization, if that is what you want to do fine. Maybe there are those that can't afford the trip and the donation so they stay home and "quietly" send a donation to the organization. Is that a bad thing?

[hammer4reel]

"most so called fisherman are not even aware of many of our regs."

"Pretty sad most fisherman are taking a beating by the goverment regs and dont have the balls to help themselves !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"


Please stop generalizing and putting people down. Don't we get slammed enough by the tree huggers? There is no need to berate those that aren't as vocal about their support. Educate those that don't know and they may join in the battle, put them down and they will walk away.

I feel this is a different type of forum and you will never see the amount of traffic here that you see in other areas. Here I read the post, learn, comment if I want to, take action, by supporting what organizations I can by the means I can. In the other areas I may view a post many time more just to see what snappy comeback someone else has posted. So there are going to be more views on that type of post.

As for trips to support an organization, if that is what you want to do fine. Maybe there are those that can't afford the trip and the donation so they stay home and "quietly" send a donation to the organization. Is that a bad thing?


Ron MAYBE its not berating anymore, its trying to open up some people who are just not willing to step up until its too late.

The guys that have been doing ALL the fighting for us are tired.
Tired from the fighting, tired from banging their heads against the wall WONDERING why if they can stand up that the people they are fighting for just sit on the sidelines and then BITCH they didnt do enough.
The tree huggers will use EVERY dime they have to take away our outdoors, and OUR OWN are letting them do it by not helping somehow, even if its just showing support to the guys who will FIGHT

I really dont know how guys fighting have been able to stand so long with out more support.

EVERYONE who loves the outdoors needs to show they really have stock in it




.

[bunker dunker]

i for one am tired of"lets do this and lets do that".i served my country in the
u.s.m.c for 6 years.if that is not enough than what else.everytime i turn around there is more shite coming down the pike.i am a licensed capt. that
had a charter boat up in the highlands for 5 years but sold because of fuel
and season changes.this hole thing is a bunch of crap.the only people that
get anything out of this hole"lets take them to court thing"is the lawyers.i don't mean to put anyone down but enough is enough.if they are going to
change the rules anytime they want than whats good for the goose is good
for the gooser.in god in trust!!

[CaptTB]

i for one am tired of"lets do this and lets do that".i served my country in the
u.s.m.c for 6 years.First, let me thank you for your service. Without people like yourself I would not be able to sit here and type whatever I wish, let alone enjoy all the other (and more important) freedoms I currently enjoy.
if that is not enough than what else.everytime i turn around there is more shite coming down the pike.
I was taught by my father who left Notre Dame and joined the military during the Korean War that exactly what you describe is the very Price of the freedoms given by your (and his) service. Isn't the saying "the price of freedom is eternal vigilance?" I always took that to mean at home as well as abroad and not just as relates to foreign governments but ours as well.
the only people that get anything out of this hole"lets take them to court thing"is the lawyers.
I'm afraid we will part company on that one. I personally would say that is an extremely naive opinion, based on nothing more than opinion and little to no fact.
i don't mean to put anyone down but enough is enough.if they are going to
change the rules anytime they want than whats good for the goose is good
for the gooser.in god in trust!!

I don't feel you are putting anyone down, and I hope you feel the same about my comments. You are venting your frustrations just as I am, that's cool. However, I am not sure I get the last part of your comments. What rules are you changing??

[bunker dunker]

capttb you don't have too.the rules are no rules.its the same as war,all is fair.
after all, are we not FIGHTING to keep whats our god given right to fish.

[CaptTB]

Ron MAYBE its not berating anymore, its trying to open up some people who are just not willing to step up until its too late.

The guys that have been doing ALL the fighting for us are tired.
Tired from the fighting, tired from banging their heads against the wall WONDERING why if they can stand up that the people they are fighting for just sit on the sidelines and then BITCH they didnt do enough.
The tree huggers will use EVERY dime they have to take away our outdoors, and OUR OWN are letting them do it by not helping somehow, even if its just showing support to the guys who will FIGHT

I really dont know how guys fighting have been able to stand so long with out more support.

EVERYONE who loves the outdoors needs to show they really have stock in it


You hit the nail perfectly on the head, Hammer!! :D (sorry, that one was too good to pass up) Also I would add that the "generalizing" suggested was most certainly not generalizing and trying to apply to all fishermen. He even used the word "most" in both sentences you quoted Reelron, he did not say "all."

I guess it's different from where I am sitting, knowing what I know about the "all talk, little action" situation described by others.

Looking at the number of comments and posts on various websites about the sea bass closure, and knowing that the number of people who have actually contributed to the legal fund currently numbers less than 150, I would say the amount of support from anglers in general is pitiful, bordering on disgusting.

If people are content to talk and not act, then I am wasting my time. That does not mean I do not appreciate the people who have helped, nor does it mean I am ignoring or trivializing their contributions. On the contrary, I often make it a point to specifically thank those who contribute and help.

However, that does not alter the fact that those that do help out, in ANY way, are still outnumbered ten thousand to one by those who do nothing at all, except perhaps piss and moan on the internet, and typically after the fact.

[LegalEyes]

Just a thought.

When you get more people who earn a living working on the cause maybe more sportsman would participate.

Most of us (hopefully) have a job and a family that needs attention. The ones that make a living fishing need to step it up a notch. Outside of a few here, CaptRon, CaptTB ect who put in plenty of time effort and money, I'd like to see more of the other charters/captains/baitshops/marinas step it up a bit.

Some of us are trying to just get by working extra hours and doing whatever needs to be done to pay the bills, and keep our jobs. Would I be upset if I couldn't take my kids out for fluke, Of course, but in the grand scheme of things its a bit low on my priority list.

I might be fighting for my sport, you're fighting for your livelyhood.

Free video services to the cause, I've offered before but never get a response. Maybe you don't neet it, but its available if you ask.

[LegalEyes]

Sorry, double post.

[Capt. Jerry P]

First off big thanks as always for all the guys busting their ass for fisherman!

Capt Tony and others always provide us with the facts and up to date information as well as answer alot of questions... And thats just in between all the real work they do meetings,lawsuits research etc

I have been trying to push the rfa lawsuit over the seabass closure to my customers friends and fellow anglers and passing on all the info i can. ( Most of which is facts provided online By Capt Tb)

I headlined it on the front page of the Fish Mongers website and face book page... got the 1 pager to handout to all customers... and have been thinking of some creative fundraising in the winter time to just help with a general donation to ssff rfa etc.

With that said what i do might not change anything but if everyone does something... whatever they can everyone will be better off in the long run and could prob change alot no?

In the same token ya cant fault people for Joining a challenge trip reading reports etc... That doesnt mean those people are interested, dont care, wont donate etc and in my honest doesnt bode well for drumming up support!

I too would like to see more interest in this forum

But i havent seen hardly any charter or party boat capts getting involved this forum either and i am sure they care deeply regulations about... I am sure a lot are a big help behind the scenes. maybe some arent good with computers etc...

Maybe if some get involved... some customers will follow... lead to a few more ...mayby not... maybe we will never know.

I also found it very interesting and give Capt Tb alot of credit for making it known the lack of support(or public support) on the seabass closure from other groups... Although they work very hard for fisherman too i though more would have headlined the seabass closure and pushed the rfa lawsuit even if it didnt directly involve there particular group at that time? Like a donation link or article summary... Now is really the time for everyone to unite.

Again thanks to those on the front line of this... time and time again... fighting for the fisherman and the future of even being able to fish!

[captmark]

Capt Tony and others always provide us with the facts and up to date information as well as answer alot of questions... And thats just in between all the real work they do meetings,lawsuits research etc

I also found it very interesting and give Capt Tb alot of credit for making it known the lack of support(or public support) on the seabass closure from other groups... Although they work very hard for fisherman too i though more would have headlined the seabass closure and pushed the rfa lawsuit even if it didnt directly involve there particular group at that time? Like a donation link or article summary... Now is really the time for everyone to unite.

Again thanks to those on the front line of this... time and time again... fighting for the fisherman and the future of even being able to fish!

Jerry your right and we do need more people and Captains involved and I have talked to Dale about getting anything going and I will be there, and yes the common man walking the street has no idea what is going to happen.

But as stated all thru to other post here everyone complains but they dont want to safe what they have.

[howarda780]

Its too bad the towns that benefit from all the fisheries don't chip in.

The overall contribution to a local community that the recreational fisherman helps is huge.

When you look at fisherman that come into Brielle, PP, Belmar, Manasquan etc. just for a day or a weekend. These fisherman are buying, coffee, gas, lodging, suntan lotion, meals, etc. as well as bait & tackle.

I see that the town of La Jolla, CA did a study called "Surfenomics" that showed that the local surfers contributed approx 24 million dollars/year to the local economy. How much do you think we contribute to these towns and all the local merchants that don't even realize their gains.

[dales529]

Its too bad the towns that benefit from all the fisheries don't chip in.

The overall contribution to a local community that the recreational fisherman helps is huge.

When you look at fisherman that come into Brielle, PP, Belmar, Manasquan etc. just for a day or a weekend. These fisherman are buying, coffee, gas, lodging, suntan lotion, meals, etc. as well as bait & tackle.

I see that the town of La Jolla, CA did a study called "Surfenomics" that showed that the local surfers contributed approx 24 million dollars/year to the local economy. How much do you think we contribute to these towns and all the local merchants that don't even realize their gains.

Howard,
If you look at the associated websites, SSFFF, RFA etc and look under "supporters" you will notice that towns chamber of commerce, Bait and Tackle shops have shown support. Could it be more of course but there are quite a few who get where there economc support comes from. Its equally if not more important that those that impose the regulatioons on "flawed science" understand the economic impact as I am sure you are aware. When I ran the SSFFF trip last June NOT a single tackle shop or business I asked for door prizes turned me down.

[howarda780]

Dale, I didn't mean to generalize, but I was trying to make a point. Sometimes the business's take everything for granted and they don't realize it until its gone.

When you look at commercial fishing ports like New Bedford, Gloucester and Boston that had thriving fishing communities. Then due to the closure of George's the giant draggers and mid water guys that left town and went backrupt it was a shock.

No one ever thought that the New Bedford auction would become a minor daily blip when it once was a huge indicator for pricing of fish the entire coast.

[dales529]

Dale, I didn't mean to generalize, but I was trying to make a point. Sometimes the business's take everything for granted and they don't realize it until its gone.

When you look at commercial fishing ports like New Bedford, Glocester and Boston that had thriving fishing communities. Then due to the closure of George's the giant draggers and mid water guys that left town and went backrupt it was a shock.

No one ever thought that the New Bedford auction would become a minor daily blip when it once was a huge indicator for pricing of fish the entire coast.
Howie,
Understood and its a valid point, its amazing how so many wait to react when the warnings are out there. I fished those areas in the early 80's when things were really great up there, so good that if you were an out of towner you found the bait buy boat ONLY after the locals had left the docks. At times our money was NO good
Thanks for posting

[howarda780]

Here is the article/study on how much a surfer pumps into the economy when he/she goes surfing. A surfer doesn't pay anything to surf this is for his extras. Wax, cords, fuel, eats, etc. I wonder what the cost / fisherman is for us?

.................................................. .

Mavericks "Surfonomics" Study Released

October 29, 2009, Half Moon Bay, CA Save The Waves Coalition announced today the preliminary results from its second “Surfonomics” study, a measure of the economic value of the world-famous big-wave break at Mavericks in Half Moon Bay, California. The study found that the surfing site and area has an estimated economic value to visitors of nearly $24 million per year, based on approximately 420,000 annual visitors.

“Mavericks is an iconic, world-renowned surf break that’s truly unique,” said Save The Waves executive director Dean LaTourrette. “This study provides evidence of not just its environmental value, but of its economic value as well. This further reinforces the notion that it and other special coastal areas around the world need and deserve to be protected.”

The study combined the economic value visitors place on the wave with intrinsic or cultural values of a coastal location with a world-class wave such as Mavericks. An important goal of the project was to build a model that can inform decision makers in coastal communities with important waves around the world. While prior studies of the value of waves have focused on the economic impacts of a contest or industry to local economies, this study looked at the benefits that surfing provides to surfers and observers by focusing on the value they place on the Mavericks wave through what they give up to experience it, as well as their qualitative comments.

The study, entitled “The Value of a Wave: An Analysis of the Mavericks Region,” was conducted by University of Hawaii Economic Research Organization, in partnership with the Center for Responsible Travel at Stanford University, under the guidance of Save The Waves Coalition. The study was made possible by a grant from the Morgan Family Foundation, and Mavericks Surf Ventures as well as contest sponsor Jim Beam helped promote and support the study.

The results come just in time for the 2009/2010 Mavericks Surf ContestÒ opening ceremonies, which will take place at 2:30pm on Friday, October 30, 2009 at Mavericks Beach followed by a reception at 4:30pm at nearby Oceano Hotel & Spa. Save The Waves will be on hand at the event with more detail about the study.

Summary of Key Findings:

1) The wave at Mavericks has an estimated minimum economic value to visitors of $23.9 million per year. (*)

2) The average visitor is willing to pay a minimum of $56.70 per trip to the Mavericks surf area.

3) Surfers visit the area nearly five times more often than non-surfers and thus accrue more value from the area.

4) The study did not include the Mavericks Surf Contest, which has drawn anywhere from 10,000 to 50,000 people to the area on contest day, and thus results in additional economic value to visitors each year.

5) Almost 90% of the respondents labeled surfing an ecotourism activity, and thus important to the cultural and environmental health of the community. Respondents believed that Mavericks helped to positively define the Half Moon Bay area.

(*) Based on estimated visitation levels of 421,431 per year

For background information on Save The Waves Surfonomics click here.


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Above photo: Mavericks surf in all its glory. Photo by William Henry



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