Striped bass question :

[AndyS]

About 15 or 20 years ago if my memory serves me correctly there was a massive school of striped bass that sat off Island Beach State Park for what seemed to be months. Hundreds of party boats, charter boats as well as private boats fished this massive school day in and day out. Those fishing on the beach would reel in a bass, back out and have another angler step in, the picket fence of anglers stretched for miles. My question is do we know what strain those fish were ? Were they Chesapeake or Hudson strain ?
Fast forward to today, reading the reports of what seems to be a repeat of 20 years ago, a seemingly massive school of fish. Are these fish normally there in such numbers but outside the 3 mile limit so we rarely see them. Are these fish a Hudson/Raritan strain of fish ? Are there strains of striped bass from say Montauk or Cape Cod. Surprisingly enough as great as the fishing is say North, the waters seem somewhat barren below Ocean City New Jersey.
Are there always this many striped bass ? I am in awe reading the reports thinking about just how many fish there are really are, this has been going on for weeks. Is it food and water temps that create these massive schools of fish ?

[reelfitter]

I have my opinion, and its my opinion only. BAIT!! In order to have any species be able to sustain themselves, and stay. You need feed. The bunker pods, sand eels, etc, etc are plentiful. Therefor the predator stays. Keep Omega protein where they belong and things will be just fine.
As far as what strain it is? I have no clue. I'm sure there is data to back up that question. Again, what happened to the Chesapeake strain? I have a pretty good idea. Omega protein once again. Those nets that encompass the whole bunker school, also contain may other species. The vacuum pump that sucks those nets clean, doesn't know a Striper from a bunker. I personally watched them wipe out the Chesapeake.

[jmurr711]

they sat off island beach many years since too. those fish were sand eel fish these are adult & peanut bunker fish. what starin no idea but ya see west winds kkeeping bunker tight to beach & theres more stripers than ever before, years where no bait everyone says moratorium on bass now! we may have jig fish until Dr. King day if the sand eels show up after the menhaden exit.

[Gerry Zagorski]

I don't know this for a fact but it seems to me for the most part these are Hudson strain Stripers. The reason I say this is because if you look at stock assessments the Chesapeake stock is in big trouble

https://dnr.maryland.gov/fisheries/pages/striped-bass/studies.aspx

As for why they are here it's all about food. You can hardly take a boat ride at practically any time of year except in the dead of winter and not see miles of bunker and this fall more peanut bunker than ever. No Sandeels yet this year but I think they'll show up soon as well...

Other reason I think Hudson strain is because we now have a year round fishery. People in the know can catch them all through the summer and this means they are likely resident fish.

[baseballman]

I agree with what others have said...they're here because the bait is here, and they're probably Hudson fish.

There has to be more resident NJ fish than ever before as well. Adult bunker live in our waters year round and there are more bass that stick around, too. How else can you catch fish in the same spot in late Dec and then again in early March?

It is definitely an amazing fishery, and let's hope it lasts for years to come!

[Bluefish]

i think there is one more factor that exists. no typical fall blue fish run at all. even when both are there together it was more the blues on top and the bass below them, not rolling freely on top forever like we see today.

[Capt John]

Fellow Anglers...

Gerry and others....it is, like you say, all about bait. In 18 years of chartering in and around Raritan Bay, I've have never seen the massive numbers of beautiful Stripers as I have witnessed starting around October 7th when these massive females arrived. When called and asked if I would allow them to retain a trophy female, I refused and they probably moved on, but you know what....I sleep well at night knowing I did my part.

Coincidentally, this current explosion of Stripers occurred right after Hurricane Ian passed us and blasted the Nova Scotia, Prince Edward Island area back in September if my memory serves me correct.

Add to that the bunker boats not vacuuming the bay, and you have what you see today.....an absolute Striped Bass bonanza...but we must be conservatively vigilant. RELEASE ALL FEMALES PLEASE. Keep your 28-38" NJ Striper and safely release the rest to fight another day. We keep what the law allows and the rest goes safely back in....no exceptions.

Gerry...you are spot on with your assessment. Thanks for letting me post here. If not, thank you anyway.

[Duffman]

So the question…….

When did the start of the decline of the Chesapeake stock begin and did it have anything to do with the bass being beaten on by hundreds of boats for months?

Or, is this more to do with Omega Protein and bycatch?

[hammer4reel]

So the question…….

When did the start of the decline of the Chesapeake stock begin and did it have anything to do with the bass being beaten on by hundreds of boats for months?

Or, is this more to do with Omega Protein and bycatch?

Guys from all over were heading to VA a to catch a 50 pound fish while they were stacked up from November till April .
Thousands of breeders taken just for a dock shot crippled that fishery quick .

Fish couldn’t take that kind of punishment ever year .

.

[Capt Sal]

So the question…….

When did the start of the decline of the Chesapeake stock begin and did it have anything to do with the bass being beaten on by hundreds of boats for months?

Or, is this more to do with Omega Protein and bycatch?

All the above. Commercial pressure ,poaching and lack of bunker. A large portion of the stripers wintering off the coast of Virginia are Hudson strain. Not all the Hudson stripers winter over in the upper Hudson. When the Hudson fishery would slow down in June the Chesapeake fish would show up oceanside. Not so anymore or at least not the way it was in 2002. Was up a few weeks ago and took the grandchildren out. Great fall fishing and all on shads. Kept a couple 34'' fish and had a great meal for the whole family. I am ok with the 24-38 one fish limit it worked.

[Duffman]

Guys from all over were heading to VA a to catch a 50 pound fish while they were stacked up from November till April .
Thousands of breeders taken just for a dock shot crippled that fishery quick .

Fish couldn’t take that kind of punishment ever year .

.

Which leads to the next question…….

Are we doomed to repeat that same scenario with the northern bite that’s been going on for weeks?

The 38” limit sounds all well and good, but what’s the mortality on those released fish? No body mentions the floaters all over the place that were “safely released”

[Gerry Zagorski]

I think they also still have a commercial fishery for Striped bass in MD and VA albeit a small fraction of what it used to be since there are fewer fish around.

If I'm not mistaken, VA is also the only state left that allows commercial bunker reduction harvesting inside it's 3 mile line and that can't be helping the Chesapeake fishery either.

This is not to say this is the entire reason for the Chesapeake decline. As Dan mentioned recreationals have hammered this fishery for years now and the old regulation assumptions of increasing the size restrictions when a fishery was in trouble actually forced people to target and keep larger breeders. That is why all states have slots now and the reason NJ bonus tags switched from retaining one additional larger fish to one fish between 24 and 28.

[Capt Sal]

Which leads to the next question…….

Are we doomed to repeat that same scenario with the northern bite that’s been going on for weeks?

The 38” limit sounds all well and good, but what’s the mortality on those released fish? No body mentions the floaters all over the place that were “safely released”
When fishing Shads most bass are mouth hooked. When chunking many were gut hooked. Way less mortality loss.

[bulletbob]

Wouldn't it make sense once an angler has what he will be taking home, to simply mash the barb down?. Shads are cheap. Why not just take the barb down, and you would most likely not even have to boat the fish..

[Gerry Zagorski]

Which leads to the next question…….

Are we doomed to repeat that same scenario with the northern bite that’s been going on for weeks?

The 38” limit sounds all well and good, but what’s the mortality on those released fish? No body mentions the floaters all over the place that were “safely released”

Circle hooks now needed for bait fishing and most fish which are jigged are lip hooked. Not saying there isn't any release mortality but I assume it's better than it has been in the past...

[CODCHALY]

I've jigged single hook bunker better then some will ever snag treble. Ban treble.

[Ol Pedro]

Wouldn't it make sense once an angler has what he will be taking home, to simply mash the barb down?. Shads are cheap. Why not just take the barb down, and you would most likely not even have to boat the fish..

I'm with you Bullet. Going with heavier line would also help after you have your fish in the box. I just stop fishing.

[dales529]

http://www.asmfc.org/files/PublicInput/AtlStripedBass_DraftAddendumI_PublicComment_Nov202 2.pdf

2.2.2 Status of the Stock
Female spawning stock biomass (SSB) and fishing mortality rate (F) are estimated on a regular
basis, and compared to target and threshold levels (i.e., biological reference points) in order to
assess the status of the striped bass stock. The 1995 estimate of female SSB is currently used as
the SSB threshold because many stock characteristics, such as an expanded age structure, were
reached by this year, and this is also the year the stock was declared recovered. The female SSB
target is equal to 125% of the female SSB threshold. The associated F threshold and F target are
calculated to achieve the respective SSB reference points in the long term.
In November 2022, the Board reviewed the results of the 2022 Stock Assessment Update,
which uses the same forward projecting statistical catch-at-age model from the peer-reviewed
2018 Benchmark Stock Assessment. The model uses fishery-dependent data and fisheryindependent survey indices to develop catch-at-age matrices and estimate annual population
size, fishing mortality, and recruitment. Data through 2021 were added to the model, and the
model structure was adjusted for 2020-2021 to account for the regulation changes
implemented through Addendum VI to Amendment 6.
The 2022 Stock Assessment Update found that the stock remains overfished but is no longer
experiencing overfishing in the terminal year (2021). Female SSB in 2021 was estimated at 143
million pounds, which is below the SSB threshold of 188 million pounds and below the SSB
target of 235 million pounds. F in 2021 was estimated at 0.14, which is below the F threshold of
0.20 and below the F target of 0.17. The reference points were updated using the low
recruitment assumption, which resulted in a lower F target and F threshold compared to the
2018 Benchmark Assessment.
The assessment also indicated a period of strong recruitment (numbers of age-1 fish entering
the population) from 1994-2004, followed by a period of low recruitment from 2005-2011
(although not as low as the early 1980s, when the stock was considered collapsed). This period
of low recruitment contributed to the decline in SSB that the stock has experienced since 2010.
Recruitment of age-1 fish was high in 2012, 2015, 2016, and 2019 (corresponding to strong
2011, 2014, 2015, and 2018 year classes), but estimates of age-1 striped bass were below the
long-term average in 2018, 2020, and 2021. Recruitment in 2021 was estimated at 116 million
age-1 fish, below the time series average of 135.7 million fish.
Draft Document for Public Comment
7
The 2022 Assessment Update also included short-term projections (using the low recruitment
assumption) to determine the probability of SSB being at or above the SSB target by 2029,
which is the stock rebuilding deadline following the initial overfished determination in the 2018
Benchmark Assessment. The 2022 Stock Assessment Update indicates that under the current
fishing mortality rate, there is a 78.6% chance the stock will be rebuilt by 2029, indicating a
reduction in catch is not necessary at this time.
The next stock assessment update is scheduled for 2024 with a terminal year of 2023.

[baseballman]

Circle hooks now needed for bait fishing and most fish which are jigged are lip hooked. Not saying there isn't any release mortality but I assume it's better than it has been in the past...

Agreed. I've probably hooked about a dozen overs since the new circle hook regs went into effect and all of them are beautifully right in the corner of the mouth. I can't imagine how, the bass swallow bunker whole!

You can definitely tell who doesn't follow the rules if you look closely at report photos... :rolleyes:

[baseballman]

Which leads to the next question…….

Are we doomed to repeat that same scenario with the northern bite that’s been going on for weeks?

The 38” limit sounds all well and good, but what’s the mortality on those released fish? No body mentions the floaters all over the place that were “safely released”

I am cautiously optimistic that the current slot fish helps REDUCE mortality (not eliminate it entirely, not the intent) and that this improvement over time will keep the stock healthy. There will be off years...we can't predict weather patterns or outside factors that could cause a class to be off...but we're doing everything we can to help ourselves at the moment.

What I have never understood about the striper regs is why there hasn't been a bigger effort to "right-size" the regs away from females (call them 30"+ fish) in favor of smaller fish. The bonus fish are by far the best table fare, and there's plenty of them. Slide the slot fish down a few inches and give us an extra small fish to go with the bonus tag!

[Capt Sal]

Mortality release can be helped by using heavier line. I agree it is fun to catch a fish on an ultralite but the fish is exhausted by then and will become a ''floater''. Party boats want nothing to do with noodle rods.

[Gerry Zagorski]

http://www.asmfc.org/files/PublicInput/AtlStripedBass_DraftAddendumI_PublicComment_Nov202 2.pdf


The 2022 Assessment Update also included short-term projections (using the low recruitment
assumption) to determine the probability of SSB being at or above the SSB target by 2029,
which is the stock rebuilding deadline following the initial overfished determination in the 2018
Benchmark Assessment. The 2022 Stock Assessment Update indicates that under the current
fishing mortality rate, there is a 78.6% chance the stock will be rebuilt by 2029, indicating a
reduction in catch is not necessary at this time.
The next stock assessment update is scheduled for 2024 with a terminal year of 2023.

The great and powerful OZ has spoken :D

[dales529]

The great and powerful OZ has spoken :D

Just a messenger LOL. Dont agree with all of it but putting management thoughts out there as we get them!
:eek: