Party boat prices

[TogRipper]

It seems all the party boats all increased their fares at the same time?
It seems they all decided to raise the fare 5 dollars to 70.
Seems odd as every other service provided or product sold in other industries have different prices for competition.
For example, barbers, plumbeers, charter boats, and others who provide service all have different prices when shopping for a service.
Anyone else have a thought on this?
Gerry if this needs to be moved to another part of the subject board please do so.
Thanks!

[Reel Class]

It seems all the party boats all increased their fares at the same time?
It seems they all decided to raise the fare 5 dollars to 70.
Seems odd as every other service provided or product sold in other industries have different prices for competition.
For example, barbers, plumbeers, charter boats, and others who provide service all have different prices when shopping for a service.
Anyone else have a thought on this?
Gerry if this needs to be moved to another part of the subject board please do so.
Thanks!


Fuel prices have increased, as have prices for slips throughout the state. Insurance premiums change, as do the cost of actually running the business and keeping a boat in EXCELLENT condition so that customers are safe and have an enjoyable experience. Maintaining a boat costs A LOT OF MONEY, I should know!!!!! :D

[Hanis]

Bait prices are going through the roof as well

[jakesdad]

As a small business owner, you at cost increases until it doesn't make it economically feasible. At that point you raise you price. Can you imagine a mate collecting fares of $67.50. Over the past few years insurance, dockage, bait, fuel, maintenance and all the other components that make up a business have gone up.

If we want to have a thriving industry, these captains deserve to make a profit, if they don't we will lose them all.

[vikesdad]

Life has gotten more expensive for the captains. Milk, chicken, beef, pasta..these guys have to put food on their own tables...Bigger concern is that these guys have to raise prices in a time where the fishing is getting worse. Guys that are meat fisherman will just not go if fishing is up and down. Dads that were thinking about taking two of their kids will have to drop down to taking one of their kids or go less. That's not the Captains fault, it's just life. I believe in these guys and support them 100%. A sponsor on this boat didn't allow me to pay for my son when he was about 7 years old. His quote was " we need more kids to come out fishing, I'll happily take your fare but he rides for free". They are not being greedy by raising prices, they're doing it because they have to.

[Finprof]

A counter-example would be gasoline stations who tend to charge the same price in the same area. This happens most often with commodity items that is hard to discriminate on quality.

[Capt Sal]

It seems all the party boats all increased their fares at the same time?
It seems they all decided to raise the fare 5 dollars to 70.
Seems odd as every other service provided or product sold in other industries have different prices for competition.
For example, barbers, plumbeers, charter boats, and others who provide service all have different prices when shopping for a service.
Anyone else have a thought on this?
Gerry if this needs to be moved to another part of the subject board please do so.
Thanks!

Maybe they raised the price of diesel and the party boats have to get it from the marina there in.????

[AndyS]

Trolling Mo-Jo's, who is buying bait ?
Fuel prices have dropped in the last 10 years.

[Capt. Debbie]

I don't think this is question of what justifies the price increase. That's easy to see.

I think the question posed here is an implication of anti-trust (mention of competitive $ Differences) collusion because there was an "coordinated" across the board increase for all of them. Is some one or some group synchronizing the PB fare prices? This is the question I believe is posed.

Having run a few businesses I think I can say that competitors watch their competition AND ADJUST. I see my boating school competitors now offer Senior Citizen & Military discounts I have had for a decade. Also I had offered review courses for internet students since day one, now my competitors do.

I'm sure if bench massages by real Masseuses on PB's became offered and popular they all would offer that soon off. LOL A nice shoulder massage after a hard fish fight is nice- right?




It seems all the party boats all increased their fares at the same time?
It seems they all decided to raise the fare 5 dollars to 70.
Seems odd as every other service provided or product sold in other industries have different prices for competition.
For example, barbers, plumbeers, charter boats, and others who provide service all have different prices when shopping for a service.
Anyone else have a thought on this?
Gerry if this needs to be moved to another part of the subject board please do so.
Thanks!

[dakota560]

It seems all the party boats all increased their fares at the same time?
It seems they all decided to raise the fare 5 dollars to 70.
Seems odd as every other service provided or product sold in other industries have different prices for competition.
For example, barbers, plumbeers, charter boats, and others who provide service all have different prices when shopping for a service.
Anyone else have a thought on this?
Gerry if this needs to be moved to another part of the subject board please do so.
Thanks!

Here's my take regarding comparable prices. With ports, these boats sit side by side, most with prices published. Don't think barbers, plumbers and even charter boats have a similar situation. If there's five boats side by side and one has a cheaper price, whose going to get most of the business from people who don't fish that often. I'm sure that factors into it whether it's agreed to by all or not.

More so here's my take regarding prices in general. This is where regulations are killing these businesses. People are talking about bait and gas prices. This is a capital intensive business, how much does the boat cost and what kind of mortgage do these operators assume. Interest and principal payments alone must be significant and are due whether they sail or not. Factor in property and casualty insurance, crew costs (even if they get tips), slip rental, winter storage, repairs and maintenance, ancillary equipment. All these are significant costs, required just to be in the game before the first fare steps on board and incremental to operating costs like fuel and bait.

Now factor in how many less people are sailing these days due to regulations and try absorbing what are predominantly fixed costs into presumably lesser fares and truthfully I'm amazed prices haven't increased more. Now factor in how short the season is in this area of the country, legitimate bad weather days, days with not enough fares to sail because the weather man botches the forecast and how limited the time frame is for these owners to scratch out a profit to justify their existence. And when every marina turns into a high end water front real estate development, high end marina which doesn't cater to recreational or party boats or another 9th Ave. Pier in Belmar, I don't think anyone will be concerned if they charged comparable prices to eke out a living. Most people by that time won't even remember what a party boat was.

[TopRod]

Trolling Mo-Jo's, who is buying bait ?
Fuel prices have dropped in the last 10 years.

Troll mojos for bottom fish?? Why even bother with a comment like that?
Wasn’t the KLG stocked this week??

[hammer4reel]

5 buck raise for the new year .
.

With insurance ,slip , gas fees going up it should been 20.


Think it's easy running and maintaining a boat ?
Most years your 10 grand in the hole before the first fare steps on.

.

[Capt Sal]

5 buck raise for the new year .
.

With insurance ,slip , gas fees going up it should been 20.


Think it's easy running and maintaining a boat ?
Most years your 10 grand in the hole before the first fair steps on.

.

For sure.Then you hope nothing breaks.

[1captainron]

I've been eating the over $3 fuel for the past three years, clams are now $50 a bushel (if you can get them), dockage and insurance up over $1,000 a year.

I've NEVER thought about any of this on a daily basis to do what I do and have eaten this increases against my gross income.
My dad told me a couple years ago, this is a business, when you stop making money it's time to get out. Fortunately, I have a good business, I go where I gotta go to get it done but we still have to get paid.. I can't keep taking from my end to justify the means.
If you want to save some money there are plenty of boats offering Groupon, just not me. The fare should actually be $75 for as hard as we work!!! Vikesdad made a great point in, it's a shame we have to do this when the fishing is getting worse. Blame the *******s who put us in this situation!!!


First day back, can't believe I even replied to this!
Capt. Ron

[RAMMFISH66]

I enjoyed fishing for fluke last season for senior rate of $45.00 on Monday's but guess that will not happen again...Sandy Hook here I come since the cost is free and that fits into my budget....see ya all later, Rammie

[saltfisherman]

Honestly I’m surprised a small increase is the only increase. When you consider how many times these boats will be stuck at dock due to weather or lack of anyone showing up at all, they are not earning anything yet the capt and crew will still be on board. They get up early for the use of others, not for their own health. That in itself has value, monetary or assumed value of time away from other chores.

Then you get the days they do sail with a smaller group than what is needed to break even. All this adds up and in the end if they’re lucky the year end is a break even.

They will try the hardest to put you on fish and run around all over to do so. All of us know which boats go out of the way to do just that. This all takes time and money to do so. It’s not leave the dock and go 100’, it’s leave and go miles upon miles to get the bite.

I say thankfully there are those that still do what they are doing to transport, babysit and put up with so many personalities and thoughts that every trip is a grocery trip of full coolers.

I get on a boat and I not only pay for that privilege but I buy coffee, a sandwich. This is their getting up everyday to put up with us and ferry us around to please our freezers.

So if $5 is too much for you and it takes away from a six pack every other day, a lottery ticket you have no problem buying or a scratch off at $10 hoping to hit it big. Your priorities are a bit twisted. I say go buy a boat and see what it costs to catch that bass or fluke. I owned boats and it ain’t cheap by any means with all things added to it prior to even getting it on the water.

My 2 cents and a bit of a rant.

[Gerry Zagorski]

$70 for a day on the water is an amazing value in my book....

[porgylber]

2 weeks ago I went out on a PB fishing for blackfish. I was one of 8 guys on the boat, on a beautiful spring day. Fishing was slow, but the Captain worked his tail off, attempting to get us on fish.
On the way back in, he saw birds working over schools of stripers. 4 stops later, almost everyone had a striper in the cooler as we docked an hour later than planned.
Obviously he lost money that day. But if there were any casual fishermen on the boat that day, he gained customers for life.

[Down Deep Sportfishing]

I've been eating the over $3 fuel for the past three years, clams are now $50 a bushel (if you can get them), dockage and insurance up over $1,000 a year.


I’ll take a slip and the the name of your insurance ;)

Happy 2019

[TogRipper]

This thread was not intended to complain about a 5 buck increase in the fare. Everything increases in price. That’s life.
There was a across the board increase simultaneously by every boat. Every pizza shop in town do not all raise the price of a pizza at the same time.
I would think every person runs their business at their own price depending on their costs and profit margin.
The real customer who is happy with service or product would probably pay more. It goes both ways.
Just odd fares are increased by all the same time.

[reason162]

Just odd fares are increased by all the same time.

I think the question answers itself, no?

I remember when all the party boats stopped offering squid strips en masse. No big deal for me since I never use boat bait...but if you believe every captain arrived at that decision independently...well, you know how the rest of that saying goes :)

[Duffman]

I think the question answers itself, no?

I remember when all the party boats stopped offering squid strips en masse. No big deal for me since I never use boat bait...but if you believe every captain arrived at that decision independently...well, you know how the rest of that saying goes :)

Well said. Can you imagine one boat at a dock of six charging $10 less than the rest....ooofffaaa

[frugalfisherman]

AH boats 3/4 day $70 and $ 65 senior. Belmar ALL DAY $70 and $65. PP all day $70 and $65. PP 3/4 day $55 and $50. Brielle all day $70 and only $60 senior. My mama told me you gotta shop around.

[OH HENRY II]

When I get my 20 ft. w/a from Allentown PA to Atlantic Highlands marina for a 3/4 day fishing, between gas, bait, tackle, ice, and all other necessary things, I'm in it for at least $200.00 round trip just by myself and more if I have passengers. I can't even imagine what it costs pb captains per day sometimes with only a few fares, it just doesn't seem to equate. My point is, if anyone can get on the water for 3/4 day fishing with an experienced crew for just $70.00 do it and be grateful.

[Reelron]

Don't know why anyone would expect a group of Captains/Boat owners that are sitting and working side by side, to NOT get together and discuss pricing in an attempt to set prices that are competitive? Been looking at this post for a couple days now and it just seems silly. Even if they didn't, how long would it take for Captain A, to look at the other boat signs and adjust his price accordingly? Not exactly an anti trust issue in my mind.

If the price is the same I look for the boat that has better service and will produce.

And maybe a Senior Discount?

[SNAPS]

here's my take regarding comparable prices. With ports, these boats sit side by side, most with prices published. Don't think barbers, plumbers and even charter boats have a similar situation. If there's five boats side by side and one has a cheaper price, whose going to get most of the business from people who don't fish that often. I'm sure that factors into it whether it's agreed to by all or not.

More so here's my take regarding prices in general. This is where regulations are killing these businesses. People are talking about bait and gas prices. This is a capital intensive business, how much does the boat cost and what kind of mortgage do these operators assume. Interest and principal payments alone must be significant and are due whether they sail or not. Factor in property and casualty insurance, crew costs (even if they get tips), slip rental, winter storage, repairs and maintenance, ancillary equipment. All these are significant costs, required just to be in the game before the first fare steps on board and incremental to operating costs like fuel and bait.

Now factor in how many less people are sailing these days due to regulations and try absorbing what are predominantly fixed costs into presumably lesser fares and truthfully i'm amazed prices haven't increased more. Now factor in how short the season is in this area of the country, legitimate bad weather days, days with not enough fares to sail because the weather man botches the forecast and how limited the time frame is for these owners to scratch out a profit to justify their existence. And when every marina turns into a high end water front real estate development, high end marina which doesn't cater to recreational or party boats or another 9th ave. Pier in belmar, i don't think anyone will be concerned if they charged comparable prices to eke out a living. Most people by that time won't even remember what a party boat was.
you hit the nail on the head?
I am a buyer for a commercial ocean container carrier, costs are crazy high.

[Dclark2]

Compare fishing price to a round of golf with a cart for around 3 - 4 hours and the choice is simple to me. Add in the price of 2 sleaves of lost balls and the fee for the 19th hole and I have made my choice.

IT's THE PASSION.....................

[Gerry Zagorski]

Interesting topic here....... You'll find in any commoditized industry, business are constantly monitoring competition. The gas stations across the street from each other will change the same price to compete since they are in the same location and selling the same thing.... It's competition and the laws of supply and demand.

Further, if you look at the party boat example what would happen if one boat started charging $50 and another $100 for the same trip? I would submit that the one charging $50 would soon be out of business because if you're loosing money on every fare, you can't make it up on volume... The boat charging $100 would also meet the same fate since they won't be carrying as many passengers.... This is why you see them all charging the same and they compete on things like better service.

This is great for all of us since we have many quality fishing businesses to choose from. The competition results in more choices which results in fair prices and better service since these businesses are forced to compete for your business..

Now the wild card in all this.... What happens if fewer people are taking fewer fishing trips?? 3 main causes here are likely regulations, cost per trip and the fact that there are fewer people are getting into our sport... Nothing in the short term the party boat owners can do about any of this...This is the reality of the situation these business owners are faced with and at some point if these trends continue, you'll see fewer and fewer businesses around.

Any of you who think these businesses are taking advantage of you and price fixing or gouging, IMO you are mistaken... I think that the prices are about as low as they can go since these business owners have to make a living, they have fixed and variable costs they need to recoup and as mentioned above, if they charge too little or too much, they are out of business...

A lot of people get on the boat and start counting fares... Hmmmm Captain X made $3500 today $70 times 50 people.. What you don't see is the costs and the time associated with operating their business. Fuel , repairs, inspections, slip and insurance fees, the times they can't get out due to weather or not enough fares, not to mention the hours involved.

If you think these businesses are taking advantage of you and price fixing or gouging, IMO you are mistaken... I think that the prices are about as low as they can go since these business owners have to make a living, they have fixed and variable costs they need to recover and as mentioned above, if they charge too little or too much, they are our of business...

These guys are not getting rich.... If this business were so easy and profitable, everyone would be doing it. Fact is, there are a lot easier ways to make a buck then being charter or party boat owner.

Frankly, I'm thankful there are still some around that make the choice to stay in the business given what they're up against... They provide us all with the ability to get out on the water for a day at what I think is a fair price and a relative bargain.

[fishark531]

My 2 cents

The fares are VERY reasonable in NJ

For those that think the fare hike is excessive

Buy a boat
Pay for docking
Pay for up keep
Pay for bait

Your average cost will be SIGNIFFICANTLY higher per person and you get to clean the boat as well lol

I think a $ 70 fare is a bargain

I

[Stanton327]

It seems all the party boats all increased their fares at the same time?
It seems they all decided to raise the fare 5 dollars to 70.
Seems odd as every other service provided or product sold in other industries have different prices for competition.
For example, barbers, plumbeers, charter boats, and others who provide service all have different prices when shopping for a service.
Anyone else have a thought on this?
Gerry if this needs to be moved to another part of the subject board please do so.
Thanks!

God forbid party boat captains try to keep up with inflation and cost of doing business in Jersey!!! Why try to stir up SH$& man get a life and go fishing...buy your own boat its sure to be cheaper!!!

[OH HENRY II]

It seems all the party boats all increased their fares at the same time?
It seems they all decided to raise the fare 5 dollars to 70.
Seems odd as every other service provided or product sold in other industries have different prices for competition.
For example, barbers, plumbeers, charter boats, and others who provide service all have different prices when shopping for a service.
Anyone else have a thought on this?
Gerry if this needs to be moved to another part of the subject board please do so.
Thanks![ Solution]: If you want cheaper than $70, buy a $60 surf rod and spend $5 on bait then you'll be ahead of the game.;)

[Charlie B]

Everything costs more now than it did before. As for all raising prices about the same time. Once one did it that allowed the others to do it and stay competitive. Can't blame them for trying to be profitable...Charlie

[TogRipper]

God forbid party boat captains try to keep up with inflation and cost of doing business in Jersey!!! Why try to stir up SH$& man get a life and go fishing...buy your own boat its sure to be cheaper!!!
I sense anger. It's a discussion board if you cannot have a civil discussion perhaps you should not comment as you offer no insight and only anger.
I saw a couple of posts that made sense. Gerry's post definitely shed a different perspective and appreciated.

[Madcrab]

I would like to know when was the last increase for this PB?

[Stanton327]

I sense anger. It's a discussion board if you cannot have a civil discussion perhaps you should not comment as you offer no insight and only anger.
I saw a couple of posts that made sense. Gerry's post definitely shed a different perspective and appreciated.

I have no anger Mr Ripper but your post only makes ppl question & speculate guys who bust their ass every day all day... I rarely if ever fish on party boats but appreciate the hell out of their daily grind. Five more bucks they deserve!!!

[Capt. Lou]

If they were smart that would have gone to $75 even at that rate it’s still a bargain !
The time , work, cost of operation fish reg , it’s amazing any are left that can make a living! They were how most of us started boat fishing in saltwater , and ya I remember in the 50’s my fare as a kid was Under $5 ! Gas .30 a gallon .
Times change and today’s costs big difference !

[Harpoon]

Everyone forgets the PB marina lots have Free Parking! Cheapest parking at the shore :)

[mikeytheflop]

It seems all the party boats all increased their fares at the same time?
It seems they all decided to raise the fare 5 dollars to 70.
Seems odd as every other service provided or product sold in other industries have different prices for competition.
For example, barbers, plumbeers, charter boats, and others who provide service all have different prices when shopping for a service.
Anyone else have a thought on this?
Gerry if this needs to be moved to another part of the subject board please do so.
Thanks!

I agree that the price for all party boats seem to rise in unison, its based off the economic consumer price index - not really odd, its just something thats been happening since the dawn of trade. I must respectfully disagree that the other retailers, such as barbers, have a "different prices"; sure not the exact same cost everywhere, but I'm pretty sure there is a pretty tight range of costs for getting clipped; I expect to pay between $15-20 for a mans haircut. I think this range of costs I've referenced is applicable to all of our beautiful party/charter boats as well.

Essentially its a theoretical economic model based off of perfect competition/marketplace. In our case of party boats, I would think that each fishing businesses would indeed want prices to be the same, so you can pick the boat for your needs through price equalization.

For example - if I am at the Atlantic Highlands marina, why would I take one boat over another? If four boats are running the same trip (e.g. 1/2 day fluke), of course the one that is $10 cheaper is gonna fill up first! Imagine three of these boats at $45 and one at $35 for a half day!

With this understanding, now the consumers choices are based off everything but the price. Its about Captain, crew, amenities and the relationships we develop with all the folks on board.

I hope that my response is inferred as courteous and respectful to your request for thoughts on this matter, thank you for your post TogRipper.

Mike

[blynch]

The answer to me is that it's not an economically efficient market. Bear with me a minute.

In most other markets, each participant has its own distinct cost profile. They have a rate of return that they require to deploy their resources in the market. They set prices at the optimal level to maximize their return based on those requirements, the elasticity (price sensitivity) of the demand, and the differentiation of their product (ability to charge more by having a better offering).

Head boat market doesn't seem to play by those rules. If it did, surely one captain with a lower cost profile (more fuel efficient boat?) would charge $68. A captain with a "premium" product (newer boat? stronger brand?) might charge $75.

Why exactly it operates this way is probably something that only a captain can answer. Maybe it's because they all require each other's cooperation on the grounds and don't want to be seen as undercutting each other. Maybe it's a perception that by not competing on price, everyone does better.