Round valley trout association

[Mikey topaz]

Been talking to some of the guys from the club and Steve the president, apparently this year the club is not going to be stocking no where near the amount of trophy trout as they have in the past.... membership numbers are down and not many donations this year have been made. I know a bunch of ya guys fish there! Guys if your not a member yet please join and help these guys out the 25$ goes along way and any donations are appreciated. We are also collecting any unwanted fishing stuff that is sold at peaquest flea market and all money collected goes to stocking more trophy trout, if interested in donating or becoming a member or any info reach out to me. Where else are you guys gonna catch 7+ lb trout in jersey ???

[Mikey topaz]

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[FASTEDDIE29]

Can’t believe how low the numbers are? It’s weird! There was a ton of people at the stocking I helped with last year. Tons of boats too! I giess half of the guys there weren’t members.....??? Hope they work it out somehow!

[RWole]

Its unfortunate but numbers are down in many clubs as well as license sales.
I am a member of a small local club in my town and we have 9 members left.
We have had sons of members join and leave after a couple of years.
The younger generation is too attached to their phones and depend on an
App to do everything for them.

[AndyS]

Not good to hear. As a 501c-3 they can post on here at any time.

[akoop]

After reading this post I searched and found the RVTA website to become more familiar with what they do. The website has not been updated in a long time and is full of information for 2017 & 2018.

I clicked the Join the RVTA link on the membership tab and the first line reads
"Renewing your membership early gives RVTA a jump-start in planning it’s 2018 stocking and other programs"

The fishing regulations section list the 2017 regs.

The Annual Welgoss Memorial Tournament results are from 2016.

As someone that is not that familiar with the association I really don't have any confidence or desire to join when the site is a year or more behind.

[AndyS]

It's tough when you run an organization based entirely on volunteers. They did have a booth at the Outdoor show. I think it's all about reconnecting the people with the valley. The membership used to in the thousands.

[thmyorke1]

Im not sure what the membership gives opportunities to, I guess some access to tournaments and cheaper entry fees to them?
Maybe if RVTA wants to get more funds they could do some guide services?

Figure out a way to get people out on the water at a cheap cost. There are a lot anglers interested in RV but dont have a boat and need guidance on targeting them. Get these anglers interested in RV, then they will naturally invest in it through the club.

[Mikey topaz]

After reading this post I searched and found the RVTA website to become more familiar with what they do. The website has not been updated in a long time and is full of information for 2017 & 2018.

I clicked the Join the RVTA link on the membership tab and the first line reads
"Renewing your membership early gives RVTA a jump-start in planning it’s 2018 stocking and other programs"

The fishing regulations section list the 2017 regs.

The Annual Welgoss Memorial Tournament results are from 2016.

As someone that is not that familiar with the association I really don't have any confidence or desire to join when the site is a year or more behind.

That is a problem I know... part of that problem is none of these old member that half of them do not even fish anymore don’t wanna be bothered... they need young members as mentioned above the kids now days want nothing to do with the outdoors it’s sad, as far as tournaments go, anyone can enter member or not... I’ve found out showing up to a meeting here and there and tournaments you will start talking to members and will learn some things. Once you figure this place out it’s very rewarding,

[Hookmanski]

Maybe if RVTA wants to get more funds they could do some guide services?

Figure out a way to get people out on the water at a cheap cost. There are a lot anglers interested in RV but dont have a boat and need guidance on targeting them. Get these anglers interested in RV, then they will naturally invest in it through the club.

^This is a great idea! Too often people tell me they hate fishing at round valley because they don't have a boat and don't have much success from shore. Now we know that place is full of fish, you just have to be able to find em.

Charge people $200 for 5-6 hours of fishing, half goes to the RVTA and the other half goes to the guide, boom! Great opportunity to teach people about the lake as well as the RVTA.

This is one of the biggest issues with clubs like these nowadays, outreach. And if the young kids are on their phones (im a "young" and hate looking at my phone while fishing) maybe the RVTA could make an instagram account to appeal to them.

I'd be interested to talk to some of the guys who are a part of it, a little rejuvenation could make a big difference.

[Mikey topaz]

Thanks for all your input guys, I will make sure I share this with these guys from the club, see if they make some changes....

[Hookmanski]

Thanks for all your input guys, I will make sure I share this with these guys from the club, see if they make some changes....

Do they have any higher up members on this site currently? If not, thats step one! There's tons of people on here who would love to learn more about fishing RVR, myself included :D

[AndyS]

The website says our very own Bruce Litton is on the executive board.

[calapp]

What happened to Hunterdon Anglers?

[Castaway]

Great organization. Anyone who fishes there should join. They really do a lot for that place. The seminars they offer alone are worth way more than the $25 a year membership. Plus the thousands of dollars they spend on stocking trout and baitfish to make it a better fishery. You don’t need a boat either. There’s great fishing right from land all fall winter and spring.

[laketrout]

I fished and supported the RVTA for so many years. Very sad to see it dwindle to what that fishery has come to today. Lots of hard work went into that club by some truly dedicated individuals, as I’m sure it does today. We use to show that RVTA decal like a badge of honor. And during those days it was. I remember the pinnacle years throughout the early 90s with trucks and boats backed up 20 plus deep on Route 22 to get bait (in the dark) at 4:00am from Welgoss and his daughter Jody. They were good people. When folks knew what it meant to turn your headlights off on the ramp and load and unload off the ramp. It was also during a time when you could sleep in the truck with the boat for a first light bite and not be harassed. I also remember the night of midnight squalls that sank numerous along the shoreline camping during the two day RVTA open many years ago, and the generosity by others to help those in need during that nighttime event, and that time during the RVTA opener many years ago when I pulled an unfortunate capsized sailboater aboard moments before drowning in 36 degree water (fellow members even saved his boat). That period was the era of the sportsman, which has been replaced by what you have today. I will leave that up to you to perceive. IMO, it is a barometer of the entire state in general. Last time I was at the valley, it looked like the Great Adventure theme park.

In addition, the commorants started the demise of that fishery and changed it to what you have today. But that’s another story...

[Jigman13]

I fished and supported the RVTA for so many years. Very sad to see it dwindle to what that fishery has come to today. Lots of hard work went into that club by some truly dedicated individuals, as I’m sure it does today. We use to show that RVTA decal like a badge of honor. And during those days it was. I remember the pinnacle years throughout the early 90s with trucks and boats backed up 20 plus deep on Route 22 to get bait (in the dark) at 4:00am from Welgoss and his daughter Jody. They were good people. When folks knew what it meant to turn your headlights off on the ramp and load and unload off the ramp. It was also during a time when you could sleep in the truck with the boat for a first light bite and not be harassed. I also remember the night of midnight squalls that sank numerous along the shoreline camping during the two day RVTA open many years ago, and the generosity by others to help those in need during that nighttime event, and that time during the RVTA opener many years ago when I pulled an unfortunate capsized sailboater aboard moments before drowning in 36 degree water (fellow members even saved his boat). That period was the era of the sportsman, which has been replaced by what you have today. I will leave that up to you to perceive. IMO, it is a barometer of the entire state in general. Last time I was at the valley, it looked like the Great Adventure theme park.

In addition, the commorants started the demise of that fishery and changed it to what you have today. But that’s another story...

You should post more. That was awesome.

[RWole]

Well stated! Yes being courteous on any ramp is becoming a thing of the past.
I see that at the Sheds too often and alot of places are becoming amusement parks. The reason I like to fish is to get away from these clowns and it seems like they are now everywhere.

[acabtp]

i like the guide service idea, but i don't think that would work because of the rules for for-hire vessels... would need a six-pack captain unless all of the money is a donation to RVTA? maybe capt dave can chime in

i don't know about other people, but even more than going out on someone else's boat, i would love for an RV old timer to come on MY boat and show me what i'm doing right or wrong. can still take a nice donation for RVTA, gives anglers a head start on the reservoir, and avoids the problem of needing the six-pack license.

[AndyS]

Hunterdon Anglers was run by an egotistical maniac that wanted nothing more than to see the RVTA crash and burn for what ever reasons. BUT with that being said RVTA could have encompassed more of the region into their format. I think after the brown trout fishery crashed many anglers found a new love, the hybrids at Spruce Run.
And yes, many areas that were once "owned" by fishermen now look like amusement parks, and you wonder why license sales are down.

[Hookmanski]

i like the guide service idea, but i don't think that would work because of the rules for for-hire vessels... would need a six-pack captain unless all of the money is a donation to RVTA? maybe capt dave can chime in

i don't know about other people, but even more than going out on someone else's boat, i would love for an RV old timer to come on MY boat and show me what i'm doing right or wrong. can still take a nice donation for RVTA, gives anglers a head start on the reservoir, and avoids the problem of needing the six-pack license.

Good point about the Six-Pack, I didn't even think about that. But if someone has a 12-14 foot jon boat and somebody wants to pay them to take them out on a reservoir, who would know? ;) After reading up on the six pack license part, its no wonder we dont have many freshwater guides in the state. $600 dollars and 3 weekends of 9-5 classes is a bit ridiculous for freshwater, though i think it makes sense for the bigger party boats going out on the ocean.

Your idea is great too! $50-$100 donation to RVTA gets you 2 hours of a knowledgable angler on your boat giving you tips about the body of water? Sounds great!!

[osumms23]

sucks to see round valley numbers on the decline, however, I am not surprised. I refuse to fish round valley anymore. Cant believe im saying this, but it needs a higher park ranger/game warden influence. Launching a boat on a nice day is mobbed. people fishing in the boat launch area, taking pictures, having car photo shoots, kayaks, paddleboards are everywhere, and during the summer inflatable swans!!!

The park is over fished and need some of the recreational activites to be redirected to the actual park side.

[Hookmanski]

sucks to see round valley numbers on the decline, however, I am not surprised. I refuse to fish round valley anymore. Cant believe im saying this, but it needs a higher park ranger/game warden influence. Launching a boat on a nice day is mobbed. people fishing in the boat launch area, taking pictures, having car photo shoots, kayaks, paddleboards are everywhere, and during the summer inflatable swans!!!

The park is over fished and need some of the recreational activites to be redirected to the actual park side.

^This is very true as well, I was out there with a buddy on Kayaks last summer and a 55+ woman flipped her tiny sailboat 10ft away from me. She had a life jacket on, but what a mess. Ever had a little old lady hang from your kayak paddle before? :D

There are definitely some changes that need to be made over there, but i dont see that happening anytime soon unfortunately. The state is really trying to make it welcoming to families which is working, and population in the area has grown a lot.

[UglyStick]

sucks to see round valley numbers on the decline, however, I am not surprised. I refuse to fish round valley anymore. Cant believe im saying this, but it needs a higher park ranger/game warden influence. Launching a boat on a nice day is mobbed. people fishing in the boat launch area, taking pictures, having car photo shoots, kayaks, paddleboards are everywhere, and during the summer inflatable swans!!!

The park is over fished and need some of the recreational activites to be redirected to the actual park side.

Same thing that happened to Monksville... the launch areas are amusement parks... especially since they started renting kayaks at the launch... Aeroflex is headed that way too...

[hammer4reel]

Hunterdon Anglers was run by an egotistical maniac that wanted nothing more than to see the RVTA crash and burn for what ever reasons. BUT with that being said RVTA could have encompassed more of the region into their format. I think after the brown trout fishery crashed many anglers found a new love, the hybrids at Spruce Run.
And yes, many areas that were once "owned" by fishermen now look like amusement parks, and you wonder why license sales are down.

Brown trout fishery didn’t crash . They shocked those beautiful fish to get them out of there to promote the laker fishery .

When they started stocking Lakers the fry were crushed by the big brown trout.
Can only wonder how good the trout fishery would have been if lakers had never been brought in .

We used to throw 7/8 pound browns back nightly in their hay day .
.
Had hoped the kamaloop fishery would hold , but that never did anything either .

.

[15FOOTER]

Anyone think the KILL EM ALL motto at the valley has a wee bit to do with it as well?

[Mark B.]

Brown trout fishery didn’t crash . They shocked those beautiful fish to get them out of there to promote the laker fishery .

When they started stocking Lakers the fry were crushed by the big brown trout.

.

Fake News

[Jigman13]

Anyone think the KILL EM ALL motto at the valley has a wee bit to do with it as well?

Yep, probably.

[bassnblues]

I lost respect for this organization when they fought against the handicap accessible concrete walkway complaining it would get in the way of launching boats.

[Castaway]

Anyone think the KILL EM ALL motto at the valley has a wee bit to do with it as well?

How many rainbows/browns are you allowed to keep?

[AndyS]

Need to update the website, the calendar of events is all 2018.

[hammer4reel]

Fake News

wish it was.
But its not.

[Mark B.]

wish it was.
But its not.

I worked for the NJDF&W as fisheries worker, then as a fisheries biologist at the Lebanon FW Fisheries Lab, Lebanon from 1977 - 2018.

In the 1970's, Lake Trout were introduced in to RVR. The biologists never thought that the Lakers would reproduce. Unfortunately, they did reproduce. And, their increased numbers decimated the forage population of Alewife Herring. That's what caused the Brown Tout population to crash.

"They shocked those beautiful fish to get them out of there to promote the laker fishery . When they started stocking Lakers the fry were crushed by the big brown trout." = pure BS

"Can only wonder how good the trout fishery would have been if lakers had never been brought in." = true

[hammer4reel]

I worked for the NJDF&W as fisheries worker, then as a fisheries biologist at the Lebanon FW Fisheries Lab, Lebanon from 1977 - 2018.

In the 1970's, Lake Trout were introduced in to RVR. The biologists never thought that the Lakers would reproduce. Unfortunately, they did reproduce. And, their increased numbers decimated the forage population of Alewife Herring. That's what caused the Brown Tout population to crash.

"They shocked those beautiful fish to get them out of there to promote the laker fishery . When they started stocking Lakers the fry were crushed by the big brown trout." = pure BS

"Can only wonder how good the trout fishery would have been if lakers had never been brought in." = true

Then why were we told by FG workers in 1978 that there was a significant number of large browns taken during the thermocline flip to allow some laker fry to have a better chance of survival.
The fishery I experienced as a kid in the mid 70's was over well before the lakers had a chance to hurt the herring population

was plenty of herring still in RV ten years after that.

.
second question is then its your belief that the demise of the herring is strictly from the lakers ?
Or is it a combination of lack of plankton for them to survive?

[Mark B.]

Here is a synopsis of the recollections of the former NJDF&W fisheries (trout) biologist 1977-1984:


Alewife herring were extremely abundant in RVR in the early seventies, in fact there were some die offs associated with overpopulation, as was common across their range and what also occurred in the Great Lakes as well as several of the NY Finger Lakes. The brown trout population while numerous, only occupied the area just in and below the thermocline with their preferred water temperature in the sixties, there was a large volume of water at greater depths (the hypolimnion) with adequate dissolved oxygen for trout survival, but too cold for brown trout. The thought was to stock lake trout to take advantage of this unoccupied habitat, and to utilize the over-abundant alewife, adding diversity to the fishery. There was concern that large brown trout would prey upon small lake trout fry, which lead to the initial stocking of lake trout as yearlings, probably closer to 8 inches in length. Subsequent sampling showed that survival of this stocking was excellent. After the first stocking of yearlings, subsequent stockings were made of fingerlings. At no time was any plan enacted or actions taken to remove brown trout to give laker fry a better chance of survival, I don’t know who told you that or why, perhaps they were pulling your leg.

The decline of the alewife (herring) population began, although not immediately noticed, nearly at the same time of the initial lake trout stocking. There are a number of causes that are suspected, however the natural system is complex and no one is absolutely certain. The fertility of RVR and subsequently phyto and zooplankton production began to decline around the same time. Although the initial stocking numbers of the lake trout were fairly small, perhaps just the added pressure on the alewife forage base was enough to start a population decline. Perhaps other fish species were consuming the zooplankton that the alewife depend on (maybe smaller lake trout were the culprit). There are unknown factors of diseases or other environmental (temperature, water chemistry, oxygen) conditions. What is known is that alewife herring population crashes have been documented in many lakes and reservoirs in the northern half of the country in the past decades, and no one cause has been identified. The bottom line is that now RVR supports less total biomass (lbs/acre) of salmonids (all trout species) than in the glory days, but lake trout makes up a significant percentage of that total, while prior to lake trout stocking, the brown trout did.

[hammer4reel]

Thanks for your reply Mark

[thmyorke1]

Great info once again, Mark.

[Dave B.]

Sheesh, you would think by now some guys would learn not to question it when one of our top freshwater fisheries biologists tells you something! Ya just had to go and make him lay out the entire condensed history. Go figure...

[reason162]

Sheesh, you would think by now some guys would learn not to question it when one of our top freshwater fisheries biologists tells you something! Ya just had to go and make him lay out the entire condensed history. Go figure...

I take your point, but I'm glad Mark laid it out for me to read...fascinating and tragic history. Would've loved to see the brown trout fishery at RV during its heyday!

[Dave B.]

I take your point, but I'm glad Mark laid it out for me to read...fascinating and tragic history. Would've loved to see the brown trout fishery at RV during its heyday!

Most definitely agree on the browns, awesome fish! I can't wait for the Div. to finally get the roofs and solar panels over the raceways at Pequest so we can get back to raising and stocking browns again!

[RWole]

Agree 100 percent regarding stocking browns once again. The question is
when! It has been quite a few years now and I emailed fish and game a couple of months ago and they still did not have a time frame of when raising browns is going to happen, should not take this long, it is not that big of a project.

[hammer4reel]

Sheesh, you would think by now some guys would learn not to question it when one of our top freshwater fisheries biologists tells you something! Ya just had to go and make him lay out the entire condensed history. Go figure...


If you read what he wrote . Their was a lot of concern about the browns eating the Lakers when the lake trout program started.
Only difference is at that time there was also talk about what could be done to help that program .

Unlike some many of us were fishing there when this happened.
Old timers I fished with got so disgusted with how quickly the brown trout fishery changed . Went from fishing 4 days a week to selling their boats .
.
Only thing I would still disagree with is there was not a total decline in the herring there in the late 70's . As we saw big pods nightly until the mid 80's.

I just about lived at Round valley from mid 70 till 1990.

[Mikey topaz]

Agree 100 percent regarding stocking browns once again. The question is
when! It has been quite a few years now and I emailed fish and game a couple of months ago and they still did not have a time frame of when raising browns is going to happen, should not take this long, it is not that big of a project.

Rvta stocked em last year and year before that... along with Golden’s as well this year word on the street is trying to get some tiger trout,

Guys might be tight lipped in the club and I understand where you guys are coming with all your concerns... but there ya go you don’t see the state stocking Browns,

[Mark B.]

More info from the 1977 - 1984 NJDF&W's Trout Biologist:

In the late 1970's, a Rutgers Graduate student of Limnology, set up a study to analyze the fertility of RVR and its alewives. Secchi disc readings were almost unlimited, indicating very clear, unproductive water. Very low chlorophyll a levels ( a measure of phytoplankton) were found. Small mesh gill nets were set to capture alewives. Trawling was also attempted. Only a few token alewife were caught. Not nearly enough alewives to analyze for the study. The study was abandoned.

If you think about it, with a well established population of larger brown & rainbow trout (along with the first group of lakers which grew exceptionally fast) faced with a rapidly declining alewife food supply, the fishing may have remained pretty good for a while, - a good population of large hungry fish, eager to bite because of the reduced forage base.

[hammer4reel]

More info from the 1977 - 1984 NJDF&W's Trout Biologist:

In the late 1970's, a Rutgers Graduate student of Limnology, set up a study to analyze the fertility of RVR and its alewives. Secchi disc readings were almost unlimited, indicating very clear, unproductive water. Very low chlorophyll a levels ( a measure of phytoplankton) were found. Small mesh gill nets were set to capture alewives. Trawling was also attempted. Only a few token alewife were caught. Not nearly enough alewives to analyze for the study. The study was abandoned.

If you think about it, with a well established population of larger brown & rainbow trout (along with the first group of lakers which grew exceptionally fast) faced with a rapidly declining alewife food supply, the fishing may have remained pretty good for a while, - a good population of large hungry fish, eager to bite because of the reduced forage base.

Many people believe if the pumps were turned on a few times a year during high water that bringing river water into the valley would put the food back into the valley the alewife need .
Wondering what your thoughts are on that .
As after the dam work gets completed is that a possibility ?

And possibly keep fishing there more consistant for longer periods